Update 12/11/2007 - 1.11 Patch and a change

[Blue_Wyrm]

I really approve the change to HiPS, and any other similar changes proposed in the future to un-cheese some classes WotC obviously put no thought into balancing (I'll do my part by making magical scythes next to impossible to find...). On the other side, I am entirely un-surprised that stealth still does not work perfectly, and I'm ready to bet 10$ my toolset will keep crashing when I come back tomorrow evening (durrrr).

Oh, and on-topic, did you replace the loss of HiPS with anything? Or is the first lvl of SD void of any benefit at all?

A shadowdancer gets +1 reflex saves, 8+Con HP and 6+Int skill points at first level. You also get 3 more levels to progressively think up why you'd be able to disappear while standing in the middle of a street. ^_^

[ThePaganKing]

I understand what line of sight means, but the way it was posted almost sounded as if you had to have something between you and the creature/character the whole time instead of when you initiated the stealth.

I guess it was just a clarification question

[GodBeastX]

I figured it was just confusion. Yeah, you gotta initiate stealth out of view, then when you come into view you're all good.

[zkeleton]

Just a few days ago in a different thread it was basically said go ahead and power build we dont care, just be prepared to face the consequences. Fine. Now you're saying we're going to nerf classes so you can't power build. So wich is it? Clarification would be nice.

And, its not as if there aren't consequences to building a char a certain way. Take the scythe weilding char for example. He's gonna do less damage and have less chance of hitting because of the way he's set up. He's taking an offensive hit for more defense, a pretty common trade off. And, what's un-roleplay about a big half-orc wanting to carry around a big weapon while carrying a big giant sheild? Now, if that char had a 8 WIS and acted like they knew the secrets of the universe that would be something else.

Someone's "power build" may not be as powerfull as it seems on the surface.

[Saulus]

Just a few days ago in a different thread it was basically said go ahead and power build we dont care, just be prepared to face the consequences. Fine. Now you're saying we're going to nerf classes so you can't power build. So wich is it? Clarification would be nice.

And, its not as if there aren't consequences to building a char a certain way. Take the scythe weilding char for example. He's gonna do less damage and have less chance of hitting because of the way he's set up. He's taking an offensive hit for more defense, a pretty common trade off. And, what's un-roleplay about a big half-orc wanting to carry around a big weapon while carrying a big giant sheild? Now, if that char had a 8 WIS and acted like they knew the secrets of the universe that would be something else.

Someone's "power build" may not be as powerfull as it seems on the surface.

There's a number of flaws in that statement, and Sundren has not "NERFED" ANYTHING. We said there was no powerbuild rule because common sense applies. But as I already stated we have users like you who seem to have no issue blatently exploiting classes to gain benefits. Because a number of users like you have decided to do this we have made the administrative decision to bump that feat to level 4. The class has lost nothing, in fact it has gained integrity because now it won't be just purely for it's first feat which is HipS.

And actually he doesn't lose attack, while it shows in your char sheet that the tower shield decreases your AB, if you look at your rolls you will find that it in fact does not. As I already explained completely maxxing a char with that given example is absolute blatent exploitation of the game for PvP/PvM purposes. You don't see the problem with it because you obviously powerbuild your characters.

[rustediron]

0_o
That was kinda harsh...

And also, the scythe wielding char doesn't need AB at all to be honest, just needs to stay alive long enough to get that crit in
I think, anyway, never tried it before lol *hurriedly*

[Syrophir]

HIPS at Shadow Dancer lvl 4 instead of lvl 1. Nice.
One reason more to take more SD-levels.
I really happen to like that class, so nice job there. *thumb up*

[rustediron]

Yeah, I like it too
I had a thief/shadow (10/10 I think) in nwn1

[GodBeastX]

If anything I want to buff classes. But HiPS is just something that alot of classes having it skews them to be more powerful. Nothing like a wizard getting knocked down, then clicking stealth to avoid getting beat. With this change the wizard is sacrificing his 9th level spells to be able to do that.

For rogues, if you're out for damage, you could always just go assassin and get Death Attacks + Sneak Attacks if you're looking for the kill people route. The point is, 1 level of a class with that much benefit from it is too much cheese for us, way too much. It's why RDD's got app only, cuz you only had to take one level bard/sorc and end up this juggernaut in combat. Part of that is the class itself not having the bonus spell slots so there's little reason to make a caster/rdd.

[GodBeastX]

And we don't have a powerbuild rule because, frankly, I'm not going to take time out of my already demanding schedule to police characters who find ways to intermix classes, feats, and skills to effectively kill everyone on the server.

See, this Orc with the scythe also thought it'd be cool to run around and PVP people in front of guards and other things, because he knew he could just cut them in half with little effort. It's one thing to powerbuild too for dungeon crawling, and it's another to powerbuild so you can wofflestomp other players and pat yourself on the back for it.

[Aux]

so you can wofflestomp other players and pat yourself on the back for it.

Wofflestomp, I dont know what it is, but it sounds bad... (meaning good) ..good name for a gnome or halfling fighter too.

Nice one on the nerfing* of the HiPS, now, if we could only find some bards that can sing, and some clerics that rp their religion...







*joke

[GodBeastX]

There's clerics who RP their religeon. ^_^

[Vekin]

and some clerics that rp their religion...

Just wait till next time your PC is bleeding to death Ill forget how to RP healing....

[dharma]

Wofflestomp. Word of the freakin' day.

GBX gets +10 for originality.

[Aux]

There's clerics who RP their religeon. ^_^

Yes, it was 'humour'