Respawning in the Sanctuary of Ilmater

[thaelis]

The scar is a result of the natural healing process. Therefore, if a wound is healed with magical healing (healing spells, regeneration, and so on), that wound does not leave a scar. If the wound is healed by natural processes, it leaves a scar.

A scar is not a severed body member, so regeneration in and of itself will not just autocorrect scars. If you want to peel off a couple layers of face and cast regenerate to fix scarring, you can. Maybe Abby has a future as a cosmetic surgeon.


HP total doesn't matter. If you're missing something, Regenerate grows it back. That's what the spell does. The crux of this argument seems to be not wanting magical healing to act like magical healing to make first-aid kits and leeches a more attractive option, to make a dirty, simple-natured clinic a go-to destination for near-death adventurers. Temples and clerics are always going to be number one.

Unfortunately I'd have to agree with what Lotus said. As a pathology student you learn the unfortunate truth is that medicine is very limited in what it can achieve, with many disease processes being irreversible even to modern medicine let-alone medieval style bloodletting practices :P

Divine magics granted by the Gods should always trump the Heal skill except where those magics have already all been exhausted or the recipient cannot afford them.

[Fuzziebunny]

Reading this thread has got me thinking.

I think there it is reasonable to have lots of temples. The majority of clerics, can't cast heal or mass heal. It is sort of rare. There are hundreds of people in Sundren. One cleric, even one high lever cleric, can't save them all. There is a very real need for nonmagical healing. There would have to be. Normally you would never see 5 to 10 high level clerics. But, we are PC's. We are all high level.

RPing your healing skill is fun and interesting, I like doing it a lot too. Abby makes it really interesting but you know, Lotus has a valid point to. Clerics have access to the power of... Well... A God. So... Why wouldn't heal do it all? It is not the cleric's power....


That being said, There are certainly wounds that can't be healed. Say for instance another God was blocking the healing. Maybe your God donesn't think said person should be healed... Or for whatever reason divine magic might fail. Hell, maybe somewhere in God land there is a power play going on. There could be a lot of them. I really dislike seeing divine healing being treated like it is the weave. Wizards do what they want. Clerics... Yeah they gots to do a little dance.

Seriously, spell failure happens when your God ain't down with what you are doing. Does it have to be against dogma for your god to just say... You know what... Yeah... That ain't going to happen. I mean I don't know? It just seemed like something I should ask about.

[Mournas]

A lot of people like to see healing magic as if it only restores some arbitrary notion of "combat stamina". Let me put it this way ... when you head out to Mossdale and you get jumped by Orcs they do actually have weapons that are used for KILLING - they aren't walking around with nerf bows and foam bats. I'm pretty certain a critical hit from a warmace is going to break a bone or two and cause some internal bleeding. What happens when you get smacked way to much in combat? You either get MAGICALLY HEALED so that moments later you can sustain more injuries or you fall.

It's MAGIC applying reason to it stupid, if you get slapped with a greater restoration out in the field ~ all those teeth you just lost ~ all those ribs you just had broken ~ all those wounds gushing blood ~ FIXED ... why? Because it's MAGIC in a FANTASY setting.

It may be hard to accept because it's not real and it's not something that can be understood fully. If you want your character to have a scar whatever RP it out, but mundane healing is just that ... in other words it's not exceptional, it's not awesome, it's not a miracle, it's not MAGIC and it will ALWAYS be inferior.

[Laurk]

Actually Lotus and I are in prefect agreement it looks like. Regeneration won't do anything for bones that aren't broken, or scar tissue, nor will it eject foriegn contaminent from a wound.

A good 99% of what I use regenerative surgery for is exactly these things. Just like in real life, brain scarring, organ scarring and various other sorts of internal scarring cause all sorts of problems that need to be surgically removed. Ive seen people who can barley breath because of scarring on the lungs from a bad bout of phemonia. Ive seen knees that barley function because an old injury left clumps of scar tissue. Many adventurers RP old wounds from their background (before they had access to magical healing), and these are exactly the sort of thing regenerative surgery is for.

Id say the most common regenerative surgery I use is removing armor shards or weapon shards from wounds which have been healed without a proper cleaning. We are in perfect agreement that healing magic doesn't magically vaporise arrow heads, sword tips or anything else, therefore there's absolutley no reason that this isn't a perfectly viable and source use for regenerative surgery.

I have also used it for improperly healed bones. Old wounds that didn't heal properly and a great many other simliar problems that can all be traced to Lotus' response.

The only thing I don't agree with, is that regenerate will heal back a lost limb after the wound has long-since healed over with a nub of skin. There's no reason to expect that regeneration magic can burst through healed flesh (the nub) destroying it, in order to regrow said limb. Its conjuration magic, and this would be counter to the spells description. To me this is something open to interpretation, and of course if thats the stand of the server that his happens, ill have little choice but to accept it.

But really ive never even used regeneration magic for that because ive never encountered a PC with a missing limb who "wanted" it back. Probably because of RP reasons.

[Saulus]

The only thing I don't agree with, is that regenerate will heal back a lost limb after the wound has long-since healed over with a nub of skin. There's no reason to expect that regeneration magic can burst through healed flesh (the nub) destroying it, in order to regrow said limb. Its conjuration magic, and this would be counter to the spells description. To me this is something open to interpretation, and of course if thats the stand of the server that his happens, ill have little choice but to accept it.

No that's pretty much exactly what regenerate will do, try not to confuse what you want with what the actual intent of the spell is. It's magical healing. that's reason enough. The limb would come back, because if it didn't then it wouldn't really be magical.

This whole thread seems to be about some kind of debate on medical science circa medieval renaissance vs magic which kind of makes me chuckle. Magic is always going to be the more perfect form of healing... that's why it's called MAGIC.

[sonuvalich]

Isn't it all kind of moot when you could just incinerate the corpse away to nothing and cast True Rez? Or lop off a finger and cast regular Rez? The power of these spells gives them a whole new body. It is open to interpretation if the spell creates a body exactly like the person was one he/she died, or if it is a perfect body based on the person's original. So there I could see some room for RP, i.e. the god asks the soul what type of body he wants: scars, tattoos, missing limbs, and all.

Nitpicking aside, the power of divine magic is so great that a lvl 17 cleric could raise someone who has been dead almost 200 years provided she can give her god a decent enough description and name so as to be unambiguous. So I think a cure spell could force a foreign object out of a body as it is mending the wound. Or the power of the god providing the heal says "that shit ain't in there anymore and you feel better, because god don't half-ass it."

I am not trying to pick on people that want to RP mundane healing. I think it has its merits, and is what the commoner would likely get because the real healers are too busy to take care of every sick farmer and child that fell out a tree. But it is a spitball next to a nuke when compared against healing magics.

[cmosier]

I thought it was about respawning at a Sanctuary. Which I agree with.

[Laurk]

Well yes magic is king. About raising dead however, it doesn't always work. So while you can burn someone to ash an ressurect them as a cure to the incurable, according to source, "most" people do not respond to the call and their soul won't return to their body... thus the spell fails.

Granted PCs will always choose to return, unless they want to perma-die. However, much as its generally accepted that you should try to RP your character with a little fear of death and consequences even though you can't die (well, almost) on a PW, I feel we should also RP as healers that ressurecting someone as a "cure" is not a safe practice since "most" people don't return.

If regen grows back limbs that have been missing for years, im fine with that. All the things I use regenerative surgery for are still completely valid, and can't be done without wish, miracle or true ressurection without going under the knife. That was my only point of contention. Now that thats out of they way, Im as happy as a clam.

I also like the idea of respawns there, but beds in the temple of Sune is just as good. I just like it to appear we are waking up from an injury instead of being raised.

[Aniril_Telin]

I want to address this question but I lost track of it somewhere ... if it is to be re spawned in the soup kitchen, then... no not particularly, I would prefer to have my goody goods treated in a clean environment. I have zero issue with the temple of Selune as it populates you in the back next to an un-accessible doorway, which could easily be rp'd as having been the medical and billeting portion of the temple. I personally see no pressing need to either change the spawn point nor add an intractable area to this purpose. A minor exercise of imaginations has always served me well enough.

[Laurk]

Its not a "soup kitchen." Its a Temple of Ilmater.. you know that guy who makes up one third of the triad? As they are described in the source as some of the best healers in Faerun, I imagine they keep a clean infirmary. Still, there "are" poor people there and that could be unslightly to some of our more sensitive paladins.

Im still not sure why the temple of Selune would be treating anyone for free however.

[Tamha]

It's a sanctuary made by an Ilmateri. That doesn't make it a temple automatically.

[Laurk]

I sent you links to the source which described missonaries and the Sanctuaries they found at your request. Yes, it "is" a temple... its got a lecturn, and pews and everything. Im sorry if it doesn't fit the popular mold with some people, but I am playing a valid source character with valid source goals who has built a valid source temple.

[Intrepid42]

Perhaps dwarves could respawn at the brewery?

[[DM] Grinning Death]

This thread has gone the distance, and I'll be shutting it down. We will not be respawning anyone at the Sanctuary for the time being. Thank you for your posts.