What can be done to save Sundren?

[Gamling]

Also I say look at NWN1 servers because there are a few that have upwards of a 100 people online and they've existed before NWN2. Long before. So they must be doing something right!

[KingArthur]

Sundren stopped being fun for me when I realized that for all the power given to my PC, she was still powerless to change the world.

Bingo.

I myself know how to build areas with the tool set, and would offer myself up to produce areas if I knew it was going to be put to good use.

[Dispater]

I agree. I watch the NWN scry and there is consistently hundreds more people on old NWN servers then NWN2. I have been tempted to go see why.

Though for now I am less interested in what they do that keeps people, I want to know how to bring our players back. We need a base of active players to start moving things along and get changes rolling.

[Gamling]

One more easy suggestion:

- Implement "antagonist" characters.
I say "antagonist," because "villain" sounds too closely related to evil. What I envision is a PC who can drive their own mini-plot. This would probably need regulation - approval by a character request should be just fine. These antagonists could get their plots approved and be given certain assets to manage that plot, perhaps even leveled up for free slightly. There is trust involved here for sure - they might be given gear to give out, gold, faction points, etc. But the flip side is, antagonists must be able to be foiled. So rolled into this, I'd suggest antagonists are permadeath on any CVC death, rezzing only when killed by monsters. The goal of the antagonist would not be to have a long term character which you love - it would be to fill empty DM times without giving out full DM responsibilities. It's a crossbreed that could inject some excitement.

While this suggestion is pretty cool and I agree with this solutions core, which is to generate conflict and a dynamic environment, I do not agree with the part about having character specifically designed to suddenly have all the resources needed for a goal. Every character likely has goals, but part of the fun should be those characters trying to obtain those assets.

So instead I suggest instead of creating a new character to be the harbinger of a plot line, I say we focus on giving everyone the opportunity who puts effort into the game the chance to do something as you described.

[Sparkie]

About the server-wipe idea, I think we should hold off on that for a while. Now, about something Saulus said earlier....

I would gladly help out in any way you need, but there are the following issues: 1) I have no bloody clue where to start. On the player side of things, it's hard to know where to start in taking on the high level monster that is trying to save this server, and I for one am not the most experienced player around these parts. Which sort of brings me to issue number two. 2) I am a grade 12 student, and it's getting close to graduation time. I am relatively new to this whole "live, work, and party on" thing, and at this point in my life, much to my dismay, things are just a fricken hurricane for me right now, which has also kept me from getting server side. But, with this, I have something to present to ya'll with número tois. 3) I can't get server side..... But, with this, there is some hope. While I can't get on, someone else can..... A DM, told only of in stories and legends.... To those who know him, his name strikes both a smile, and a feeling of dread.... I of course talk of none other than DM QA. The guy originally got me into Dnd, and also introduced me to Sundren. If you don't know what's going on with him, his original computer went hurk on him, but he got it revived, but NWN2 wouldn't work, blah blah blah, I'm fairly certain that there's a thread somewhere around here that is a prelude to what's going on now. Well, QA tried to get NWN2 to work on his sister's computer, which it did, but now it won't connect to anything online (thanks to Gamespy also being put six feet under). Well, since I'm not using mine, I'm probably going to let QA get on here and let him get into all kinds of trouble, at least until I get some free time this summer, when I'll reclaim my laptop and get back on.

Well, I've put forth my two cents on this problem, and hopefully we can get Sundren back on her feet. But.... I've had a couple other ideas about what we might want to do to save the soul of Sundren. Everyone's heard of the new Elder Scrolls online, right? Well, I think we should keep an eye on this, because in this we may find Sundren's salvation, if the NWN2 server cannot be saved. (Vomits in mouth at those last words).

[Doubtful]

Sundren stopped being fun for me when I realized that for all the power given to my PC, she was still powerless to change the world.

Bingo.

OK, I accept that these are the reasons you both stopped having fun, but let's see if we can find ways to learn from them rather than leaving them as full-stop statements.

For instance, can you think of ways, systems or whatever that could be enacted to place more world control in the players hands?

(Keep in mind the fickle beast that is human lives, a DM/DEV for every player is a lovely idea, but not a realistic one).

I myself know how to build areas with the tool set, and would offer myself up to produce areas if I knew it was going to be put to good use.

If you're interested in taking on a DEV/Mapping role then I'm sure you'd be welcomed! I've a list of areas that need developing or tweaking and I'm sure most of the other staff have the same

If you've got previous examples of mapping that would be great, either post up some pics or dropbox (other storage options are available) and share (Probably best via PM or with a new post in the Help Requests subforum). If you've no examples then no problem, we can just get you to produce a small but useful area as an example!

Look forward to seeing what you can do.

[Snowmane]

#3. Focus on keeping the player base you have: NWN2 Platinum Edition is $148.99 (new) and NWN2 Gold Edition is $159.99 (new) + SoZ at $39.97 (new). These prices will make attracting “new” players to the NWN2 franchise more difficult, which also impacts the number of “new” players looking for a PW. As such, it is unlikely that Sundren will see an influx of truly new players anytime soon. I would recommend focusing on the player base that is already here (See #2). There are enough PW players out there to more than fill any server. Keep your current player base interested and the others will take notice too.

Just wanted to remind everyone that GOG sells NWN2 Complete for $20 -link-

I don't think it's the cost that's the biggest deterrent to new players, but the loss of the gamespy service for server discovery.

***oops just saw that doubtful posted the same link - guess I should read the whole thread before commenting!***

[Snowmane]

First I'd like to offer a suggestion:

There must be a ton of e-mail addresses for people who have signed up on these forums over the years. Perhaps a mass e-mail giving a quick update on the state of the server, a link to the gog page to buy the game, and an invitation to return might get some folks to come back? I know Seheren sent me a PM and *poof* here I am again!

Next, I'd like to address people volunteering from my perspective. I am a software engineer by trade and I tried to volunteer once. Saulus and I actually went back and forth on some e-mails and things looked ok at first. I was going to work on revamping the crafting system, as I found that to be one of the more interesting parts of the game. Being able to craft unique custom gear is what I believe allows a character to be recognized on sight and adds variety to adventurers who don't usually have uniforms.

I started to develop a design for a revamped sundren crafting system and I even created a section on my wiki so that others devs could see what I had in mind and make suggestions. I originally based the design off of the Pathfinder crafting systems adapted for Sundren. If you take alook at the design, keep in mind this design was started a while ago before the changes to vitality regen (I never much liked the idea of using vitality instead of fatigue anyway).

I was not given direct access to any other devs or any dev forums for collaboration. All I got in response to my design were criticisms from GBX fed to me through e-mails from Saulus. I tried my best to work under the restrictions and to implement changes to the design to satisfy the feedback, but to be honest I was too limited to work effectively. I even spent quite a bit of time on the VOIP server (I believe it was teamspeak, but I don't recall) hoping to be able to talk to someone and get some real time feedback about my design, but was never able to connect with anyone there. In the end I quit before I really began.

I know that Saulus and GBX have a lot invested in this server and I have heard about problems they have had with devs in the past, but if you want help you really need to open the door a little wider IMO.

[Doubtful]

First I'd like to offer a suggestion:

There must be a ton of e-mail addresses for people who have signed up on these forums over the years. Perhaps a mass e-mail giving a quick update on the state of the server, a link to the gog page to buy the game, and an invitation to return might get some folks to come back? I know Seheren sent me a PM and *poof* here I am again!

The big problem with mass emails is we'd only really get one shot at it, and (as Saulus has said) the wording would need to be very carefully considered. It would probably be best to hold fire until we've taken some steps back on the road to recovery before sending it, be it quests or the Northern expansion (or ideally both and more).

Next, I'd like to address people volunteering from my perspective. I am a software engineer by trade and I tried to volunteer once. Saulus and I actually went back and forth on some e-mails and things looked ok at first. I was going to work on revamping the crafting system, as I found that to be one of the more interesting parts of the game. Being able to craft unique custom gear is what I believe allows a character to be recognized on sight and adds variety to adventurers who don't usually have uniforms.

I know that Saulus and GBX have a lot invested in this server and I have heard about problems they have had with devs in the past, but if you want help you really need to open the door a little wider IMO.

It would be nice to have a codey type person, if you're still interested and can commit then we can try nudge Saulus for some green tags...

[bipolar bear]

this is gonna sound so crazy it just might work!?!?!!?!?!?!?!






get the F*ck on and play!!!!!!! I was just In there for 2 hrs and nothing!


yes things changed.. yes the circle is busted.... but the faction stuff is still there if you look for it... and yes maybe... just maybe... you can convince someone into making your own circle.



and yes I would love to see it come back.

[pixiegirl]

this is gonna sound so crazy it just might work!?!?!!?!?!?!?!






get the F*ck on and play!!!!!!! I was just In there for 2 hrs and nothing!


yes things changed.. yes the circle is busted.... but the faction stuff is still there if you look for it... and yes maybe... just maybe... you can convince someone into making your own circle.



and yes I would love to see it come back.

I feel a muse coming on......

[Dispater]

Getting in game is good, it feels strange to be online when more DM's are logged in then players! Plus, too much time by myself on the client can only lead to mayhem and destruction...

[Fezzik]

I would be more impressed with DM's if they still had the "cows from hell" ability -- that rocked in NWN

[Dispater]

I did find a spawn that may fit the bill... Though you won't enjoy it as much as I will.

[pixiegirl]

XD! Sorry, I didn't respond earlier, Fezz.

@Dispater
Yeah, we find ourselves a lot together on the client with no one to harass.