Classes not on server?

[nutranurse]

...Um, if people cannot take Emilee being an out right bitch to them and such when they meet up in the wild and she kills off goblins before they can run over and hack at them (and call me a power gamer for it <_<) Drow are a definite no no.

Drow are a responsiblity that i think only... what, a few players I know could handle? People love Drow far to frigging much, but they fail to see that Drows are like the Nazis of Faerun... (stigma wise) They most likely would try to be that 'different' drow that was all goodie-two-shoes and would want to help people out, shunning their evil kin.... I blame R.A. Salvabore for that one, but it is too ingrained in peoples mind for an effective Drow population to be plausibly established. Give it time. Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of time.

[Unholy Carp]

I blame R.A. Salvabore for that one...

Much more elegantly put than my usual epithet of "The Danielle Steele of Pulp Fantasy".

...but it is too ingrained in peoples mind for an effective Drow population to be plausibly established. Give it time. Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of time.

To encourage a cultural ideal, the culture needs exposure to it: we'd need exceptionally wicked, backstabbing drow NPCs to cause pain and suffering to a significant subsection of the Happy World Cuddlefriends.

[Maevan2]

Hey, does that mean that i can cannot play my dualwielding scimitars drow with a panther at his side? Why? I thought that this would be a really cool idea

[GodBeastX]

The original evil Drow (notice I said evil ones) did a good job. They behaved like you'd expect drow, got attacked alot, etc. They rolled with the punches and made headway as best they could. It was unfair for the whole of the drow to be spit on though when someone attacks them, dies, then makes a forum thread about how pissed they are.

Losing to PCs tends to make people VERY whiney. After DM'ing sundren, I can see why WoW still has PvE servers Some people just can't take it that another player got the better of them in combat. Probably why I enjoy making characters that suck at combat or run from it, that way I know when I lose, I expected to. I guess with all these power built eepings waving around, someone hacking them off would kill your hopes and dreams.

[ThePaganKing]

Starts to cry because he just realized his pure bard character will never be a powerbuild

[joker]

Yes, to play an evil drow roaming the surface world you would first have to have some kind of base of operations. Then you would need other minions (slaves or pawns) to help you carry out your evil plans. The most effective evil drow would be one that is very seldom seen and can exploit others to do his or her bidding.

To play a good drow would be rare and you would have to do a lot of RP for people to accept you. However, most people would just attack a drow (good or evil) on sight. Very few people would stand there and talk to a drow.

[Dark presence]

I think the stigma against drow has always been greatly overrated. I also think it is ridiculous to see in action too, from experience. If drow are all evil, scary, and can drop you in an instant, why are people so aggressive towards them? Run and flee! Or when they do die so easily, why are you so scared of them?

Now as an aside, I've read a quote attributed to Ed Greenwood that says 22% of all drow worship Eilistraee in some way, and about 10% would be full time worshippers, like clerics. So saying that good drow are rare is true, but its by no means so rare that you would never encounter one, and certainly you would encounter them more than others on the surface. And anyone who remembers my drow from the original Sundren, she would have been a prime example of that, having actually been a worshipper of Kiaransalee first and Eilistraee second.

And after some quick googling, here is a second hand source of that quote. Its in the first post. And if you didn't know, Ed Greenwood is the creator of the Forgotten Realms. http://www.eilistraee.com/forums/vie...1e8d558fd63be1

Of course this is getting off topic...

[GodBeastX]

Chances are, in an area filled with Drow you will likely encounter both good and evil. Reading Eilistraeean lore, they don't seclude themselves as much as reach out to others to get peaceful relations. However, what's more likely to reported in a place with no internet and no telephones? Also, how many Drow that follow Eilistraee of those 22% are on the surface? And of those on the surface, in a region where there are heavy Drow insurgence? From what I gathered, in the current years, Lolth is trying to expand herself to the surface.

"Yeah, people in our village hugged Drow today"

or

"Holy shit! Our village got wiped out by Drow raiders!!"

I do think at times people do take the Drow stigma too far. However, I'd rather they take it too far than not at all. I'd rather they get overly mistreated than accepted as "Just the same as everyone else".

[Unholy Carp]

To play a good drow ... you would have to do a lot of RP for people to accept you.

Not a lot, really. Given that KOS PVP is frowned upon, all you would need is to have your character immediately come across as: physically attractive, completely non-threatening, and simple-minded to the point of mental handicap. It's the holy trinity of manipulating people into being sympathetic and protective.

If you can get one or two nonevils to just observe that sort of behavior, they would have to do some mental contortions to not label anyone attacking the hypothetical drow as a bully.



Hey, does this here post of mine count as meta-metagaming?

[GodBeastX]

Good PC Drow are annoying to me because it's so easy to overturn prejudice on PW's. Why? Not because players are dumb or "Fall for crap". It's because of the flaw in D&D, the "Alignment" system which players don't use correctly. Alignment is supposed to reflect your character. Reflect him. However, people use it as a guide for their character. 4th Edition is revising it. HOwever, we're still 3.5 and in 3.5 people still make the mistake. They want to hate the good Drow, I know they do. But they are afraid of those 2 evil points. Personally? If you're afraid of evil points but want to hate a Drow, use neutral actions. Keep your distance, don't talk to them, you can even tell them you don't like em and junk. If you attack them for being Drow, or maliciously set them up for a fall, then you get evil points

I think even good people would look at a Drow and think "Ugh..." even if they knew they were good through and through. For example, how many of us will find a spider in the house, even if it's not poisonous, and not harmful, and just pick it up and play with it? Very few. Now imagine spiders were intelligent, most were poisonous, but a few are not, you know the one in front of you is not, but somewhere in the back of your mind is a fear that you could be wrong. Alot of people don't put mundane, every day fear into their RP, but that's what most of us would feel in RL.

Some of you do, though. And it adds a ton of flavor to your characters. I love seeing people take very real reactions to things. I had a little ghost haunting event and watched a player run out the door screaming, confusing the player outside. It was great. But, these scenarios are easily ruined when big mister bad comes in with a great sword, thinking "Hey, nothing can hurt me. Even though I have only 2 will save, and 8 wisdom, I am SOOOO not afraid of anything." Sometimes I even sit back and imagine what a near dead person might look like. Bones protruding from flesh, the white of inner body showing with blood pooling, it'd probably make someone vomit in RL, however, we're all hardened right?

RP is as real as you want to make it. It can be as superficial as Zelda, running around killing to complete your quests. Or as deep as an X-Files episode where the answer is out there. It's up to you all.

[Wyvern76]

*Gets a very confused expression on face. Stands slowly and claps for GodBeastX*

[Soulbadguy]

*points to the bottom at his signature* I used to play Iara'Tal'Micar. She was a drow daughter of the house. It was pretty fun with Godbeast at the wheel. Yeah, a few ooc disagreements between us players at "how drow should be played" but all in all it was fun.

Just reclarification here from GBX it was kinda unexpected at times on how people reacted to my character when she is on the surface world. Some would actualy raise her from the dead if she died.. hahah and others would be wary of her. She never got in any PVP battles because she would let the underlings do it for her. Had some real good players that played out their males well. But they got the most beef from players cause they would wine as GBX said for losing. They would say they are powerful/not fair etc. Well, are drow considered a weak race? No they are not. It was the intention of GBX to spice the drow up a little.. plus no matter where drow went we were always at a disadvantage.. so we had some help with our characters item wise and it should be..for drow usualy have pretty good stuff. If it got bad or out of line we would run. Back then it was even more limited though on were we could go. There was alot less areas then now . You can't just run off an hide easily... but we had our sanctuary.

We weren't meant to win everytime.. but GBX was trying to place some "fear" or "respect" into player characters that are non drow.

Most characters were saying after getting their asses handed to them,

" Damn drow... gonna kill them when I see them... I see one now.. charge!"

when they should of said this,

" Damn..we should shouldn't mess around with these guys. If we do.. we best make some serious plans."

Some made an attempt..but there was still too many complaints ooc.

It seems nearly impossible at times to have a Drow "evil" race on here unless it has it's own little world to goof around in so they can plot and cause problems with each other.. have drow house conflicts..etc. Even one drow house conflicting with others would be great. I always invisioned having a drow house ( one house with player characters and a DM to run it) that was kind of weak on here at first. Then as players we have our drows plot and work together to become the most powerful house in the area as time went on.

You have to find the right players too not everyone can be the matron or daughter of the matron.



I didn't play Iara "textbook" though.. because i wanted to leave that more too NPC type drow and give my drow a little more "flaws" or even a slight "heart". Not saying she was compassionate but not as violent.. in fact she was spoiled/pampered and didn't care, bored of just breaking shit or watching blood . Most drow players respected it and it caused some good RP and conflict within the drow community for the most part.

I realy did enjoy playing that character as part of the house. I would do it again if given the chance.

I appreciated GBX and is hard work in the project with the drow. Mad props to my homie GBX .

[Wyvern76]

The above sounds like it would fill an entire underdark PW, not a small part of an aready going PW.... would be grand though.

LOL... .such a server would have above ground "the raid dungoens".... raid local human villages for plunder and XP.. And the Underdark the slightly safter home. With politics and different factions and such...

Maybe someone should get on this PW!

[GodBeastX]

What I was basically trying to say in my post, is people do whatever they can to stick to their alignment. D&D wasn't meant for people at act that way. It was meant where you do whatever you want, then your alignment shifts with you. Seeing people behaving like that, D&D 4 is redoing alignment system.

[Soulbadguy]

What I was basically trying to say in my post, is people do whatever they can to stick to their alignment. D&D wasn't meant for people at act that way. It was meant where you do whatever you want, then your alignment shifts with you. Seeing people behaving like that, D&D 4 is redoing alignment system.

I agree with this because sometimes DMs can't really tell exactly whats in the mind of a character either or even the single player games when you have to make a choice that determines an alignment shift. Evil characters can be compassionate and friggin unmerciful at the same time.. it is called conditional love.. or selective love.. they choose who they love and hate whenever they feel like it. Sometimes it can seem like an evil character is doing more good than evil.. but sometimes there isn't the chance to always do evil. But there is the thought process of it as well that accounts. Selfish reasons and desires. Im looking forward to seeing this new alignment system.