Organizing Evil Cult... Interested?

[Vichtor]

But there are issues here, the last thing we need is another 'drow incident', we are not looking for a player group where devil worshippers go running around slaying other pc's at random.

So don't be like any of the Necropolis personalities...

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In all seriousness though, I don't think it's the members of the organization that will begin this. The Drow did because that's what they do. This is a completely different organization, and the major problem here will be Good Clerics and Paladins.

A Paladin will NOT just let a Demon/Devil worshipper stroll on past if he knows that is, in fact, what that person is. He is going to smite him. If he doesn't, he has to find a way to justify that against the dogma and creedo of his God or risk losing favor and having to atone (bye paladin abilities!). Whereas members of this group are going to try to maintain secrecy and isolation so they can raise their demonic power or unleash minions of their master (ultimately possibly their master himself o.O).

This situation will be the exact opposite kind of evil from what the Drow were...and it will be the Good that goes on the offensive if word ever gets out, unless there are some serious breaches in morals or Divine Dogma.

So...while you filter, profile, and sift through the players wanting to be the anti-vanilla (which is great to add dynamics to the server and take strain off DM's having to provide ALL the conflict for players; and those seeking to do this really SHOULD be filtered as a preventative measure), I'm thinking the main source of conflict will actually be on the other side of that fence.

[Lanthar]

I think every server needs something like this, but people who create a charakter of this type should also be aware of the consicuenses of being evil, as earlier mentioned, good people wont be too happy about this cult, and should be prepared that they cant roam around and trow their evilness in the face of a paladin for an example. .

Same goes with creating a good fanatic, they surely will have many enemies.

[undeadsteak]

Good people will be happy, atleast some of us. Im sick of the server not having any PC dangers or threats, just DM controlled stuff like NEcropolis isnt too fun.

[Lanthar]

Yeah, have to agree with you, makes it alot more fun playing a paladin.

[valenator]

I take this time to emphasize that evil - true, malicious evil - is cunning. The stereotype of the everyday, happy, friendly neighbor donning a dark robe at night and chanting around a pentagram is a good one. Don't put obviously evil things in your descriptions, don't give evil glances, don't take out your unholy symbol and whisper to it when people are around.

Please, sell yourselves as "normal, goodly" folk and let the evil fester.

[Elusa]

The main problem I see with this is that evil rarely comes together and stays together. There needs to be a common purpose, beyond just surviving. While good aligned characters may fight together, evil characters are more likely to fight against each other. So each character has to have something to gain. Please don't let this devolve into a murder cult, going around killing people randomly for no reason.

If you make yourself known to be evil, prepare to be hunted down and killed faster than you can spit out an evil monologue. And then, don't make plans on being revived. Ever.

Honestly, I hope this works out, because the main thing that has stopped Elusa's character development has been the lack of a tangible evil. All she has to fight right now is the necropolis, and those are just monsters, not villains.

[Ithildin]

I take this time to emphasize that evil - true, malicious evil - is cunning. The stereotype of the everyday, happy, friendly neighbor donning a dark robe at night and chanting around a pentagram is a good one. Don't put obviously evil things in your descriptions, don't give evil glances, don't take out your unholy symbol and whisper to it when people are around.

Please, sell yourselves as "normal, goodly" folk and let the evil fester.

I agree with this, I once had an evil character in nwn before he often would do something good infront of a large group of people while doing his evil in the background to keep himself out of the "good" people's sights.

[Vichtor]

If you make yourself known to be evil, prepare to be hunted down and killed faster than you can spit out an evil monologue. And then, don't make plans on being revived. Ever.

Point.

Set.

Match.

[Satoshi]

Before everyone begins spamming Delexos' PM Box with character applications, please send me a request, considering that I will be doing everything in my power to coordinate this effort and add more coherence to the idea. That being said, thank you for the support (I think your post was constructive, at least) Delexos, but once we, the players, get everything organized internally, then we'll send you all of the final draft material to be approved.

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The Cult is definitely going to be a 'secret society' evil, the kind that festers where you don't see it, even though it's right there. It's not about PvP: it's about extending the ideal of evil, and making true strife and emotional impact on the 'good' players. At some point, I want to see paid-of government officials 'agree' that the Triumvirate's local priest has been invading the privacy of poor commoners, or noble emassary, and the slandering of that person's good name must be protected in the court.

On the same note, that doesn't work with everyone's character build: those characters are going to have a place, as well, because even hidden evil can have disjointed cells that are specifically designed not to be traced back to the 'true' source.


All in all, I want this to be a serious, and well thought out idea, before we start slamming the DMs with it. It's a -player run- guild for -players-, and I don't want this to become another DM Tool to make or advance plotlines. This is our time to be evil, cunning, and have fun at the same time.

[Delexos]

After reading Elusa's post it got me thinking.. now bare with me because its 05:32 am so my thinking now is even more illogical and deteriorated than my 2am post...

What you are essentially asking for is intelligent evil pc's,after all my own main character Urthak Thunk,who has been on the server for quite some time, is by all practice and deed, evil though I suppose he could be associated under the dark advent tag as he works for them, he is however still an independant creature and can operate outside of the necropolis walls, so is it then due to his lack of perceived intellect that he is classed not as a villain but rather as a so called 'monster' ?

Regardless, I can assure you that there are villains out there and not dm npc's either, but heres the problem, a really really good villain is one that you never find out about except for whispered tales of dark figures in a tavern one night, its one that does what it needs to in order to complete its set of objectives and then gets the hell out of there. I know for a fact that there are evil characters out there, i've sat watching them plotting in dark corners, but for you to know about them and for them to therefore become 'tangible' defeats their main objective, after all once someone is known to be evil, as many here have rightly stated, they tend not to last long.

Thats why the npc villains exist, and to some extent why Urthak Thunk exists, though he is just a pc and not an npc by any means, characters like that provide a very real evil presence on the server, something the 'do-gooders' can see and stab, whilst in the mean time the other evil pc's conduct their nefarious deeds in the shadows.

Its a balancing act to be sure, I would wager that alot of players would like to gain some form of 'acceptance' by the rest of the player community be it by word of mouth concerning their heroic deeds, or hushed whispers of their villainous acts. The problem in this for the evil end of the spectrum is how to do this without loosing that all important edge a villain naturally has; his air of dark mystery..

All in all, this 'cult' may indeed be just what the doctor ordered, but each applicant must understand there is a very real chance that they are making a character that might end up dead, because the roleplay that comes from the vile darkness of a cult (at least within the constraints of the pg13 rating on the server) may well demand more than just a quick trip to the forest of eternal night until the three minute timer is up. It is certainly not a group to join if you want the world to flee in terror at the mere mention of your name, because if the wrong people hear about you, not only is your character in dire straights but the entire cult becomes at risk of being detected. The cult will have to work very closely together to maintain their secret identity and realise that their ability to keep it on the down low is for the benefit of not just themselves but the rest of thier little community also.

anyway thats enough of that ramble for now.. it probably made little in the way of sense but its all spilling out of my exhausted cranium now as I try and think through this new little group thats forming.

Hope it gives some things to think about.

[Machiavelli]

A good healthy discussion!

Great idea and some good posts here! From what I'm reading... some decision needs to be made about the specifics of the group such as demons etc (to be coordinated by Satoshi?), and then things will be bounced onward to a DM (Delexos?).

Overall, I'm well into the concept! It could be good for the server, and I've always had a predilection toward villains myself (perhaps why I used to GM p&p games more often than I played ). I would suggest that any evil group not wanting to be smited too horribly or just be silly, ought to bear in mind the teachings of the great Florentine whose name I am probably unworthy to post under (though I think enough people have made that point above )

Respect to all who've contributed good ideas above!

[Deathevn]

One thing I would lik eto add, Is that perhaps ths cult should consider including outsiders in its roster. Now, not outsiders as in demons, you people really like your demons But it shouldnt hesitate with perhaps making hidden alliences with people with questionable moral Backgrounds, known plotters and such things... rather then letting the cult deal with cult problems, Contract outsiders,Unknowning mercs, pawns in your struggle then doing evyerthing by your hand.. maybe even have a nice connection with the red wizards.... do things by other hands, create some sort of corrupted by existing inferstructure with the NPC's, PC"s both good and evil.. some real political menuvers... now mind you, anyone who know my characters know im into that sort of thing.. but hey it could be fun!

[Satoshi]

I'd like to clarify a few things, as far as the whole organization/evil thing.

1.) The main service will be to Asmodeus, though servants of Gargauth will also have a place. This fits the theme I'm leaning towards much better, and will limit the potential 'in-fighting' that may ensue if, say, a Worshipper of Mephistopheles tried to get in on the Cult activities.

2.) We will not be wanton PvP PKers. More than likely, you'll never even recognize who these characters are In-Character. These are people who are going to be common-folk, pleasant and even outwardly generous and refined. The character concept is more insidious than overt - a cancerous corruption that spreads slowly. The evil will not reveal itself until the infection is too large to hide anymore.

3.) I'm going to start the initial group, that is: the enourage that is arriving to start the corruption, very small. Like at most, six people. I want them all to be from approximately the same area, and thus have a reason to be allies and trust each other. From there, how we spread and who is recruited, will all be in character. This may take some time, but all things come to those who wait. You can be patient.

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On another note: I'm a cleric - what prevents me from raising those that are caught? However, if we are expected to take a long trip into the realm of death once discovered, simply because we are evil - those paladins that end up in dark halls of some unknown dungeon within the bowels of the earth should respect that they are in the same situation. If there is no risk on one side, and all the risk on the other side, then there's something wrong. I mean - if it makes sense, why ignore it because your 'good', or 'evil'?

[Vavutsikarios]

If you make yourself known to be evil, prepare to be hunted down and killed faster than you can spit out an evil monologue. And then, don't make plans on being revived. Ever.

I sincerelly hope this was an in character comment. If it is ooc, then it is really evil.

(edit: now that I think about it, even in character it is an evil comment. A trully good man does not smash his enemy; he spares him. But that is a much broader subject concerning the whole moral system of dnd. Certainly this is not the time or the place to discuss it)

Of course it is understandable that we will lose most of the conflicts (not all of them mind you, but most). Who wants evil to triumph anyway? (our evil chars maybe, but certainly not we, the players)
When saying conflict, I must clarify that I certainly do not mean a random meeting of a cultist and a paladin on the road that ends in bloodshed. That is just silly. I mean political plots, evil conspiracies, spreading corruption etc.

All in all, this 'cult' may indeed be just what the doctor ordered, but each applicant must understand there is a very real chance that they are making a character that might end up dead, because the roleplay that comes from the vile darkness of a cult (at least within the constraints of the pg13 rating on the server) may well demand more than just a quick trip to the forest of eternal night until the three minute timer is up. It is certainly not a group to join if you want the world to flee in terror at the mere mention of your name, because if the wrong people hear about you, not only is your character in dire straights but the entire cult becomes at risk of being detected. The cult will have to work very closely together to maintain their secret identity and realise that their ability to keep it on the down low is for the benefit of not just themselves but the rest of thier little community also.

All this is very fine, except the part about death and the forest of eternal night. If evil cultist are not accepted there (and I really would like an explanation for that, from what I have heard the presence there is not morally inclined anyhow, and the whole concept is quite vague for the players) then a more appropriate place could be created for evil chars. Hell maybe?

[Lanthar]

Gargauth, gotta say I admire those who pull off a well played Gargauth follower. .Intellectual charismatic evilness :P

Favorit evil character ever. . Hannibal Lecter.