Why the Low Numbers?

[Barathos]

This thread has turned into a Supernatural gifathon.

I'm ok with that. I REALLY am.

[sonuvalich]

Oh Dean Winchester, you and your dreamy facial expressions.

I don't see how faction conflicts would lead to lower numbers, which was the OP of this thread. If I heard there was going to be a big throw down between the Enclave and the Triad, I would be SURE to log on that day and contribute. When I heard that Meriadoc and Exigo were doing an event and would be passing through Aquor, I made sure to be on that day to add a little pretentious dick-sauce to their passage through the city. Direct conflicts are INTERESTING and I for one would not skip an event just because there would be some strife. I would not go to a nature-only event because I am not intended to be included, but I would not avoid an event because I was worried about making things uncomfortable for other characters (not players, characters).

One of the reasons I'm not logging the same hours lately is because there is no conflicts with other factions for me. Everyone talks of the tension and the schemes and the plots and the betrayals and the intrigue and the etc. etc. etc., but most of my interactions with other players have been harsh words. The closest thing to conflict I've had recently was telling Ulsteris to kiss my ass, and that was like a month ago. I want to compete with other factions to reach a goal, or collaborate with factions to reach a mutual goal, then betray them and get the goal all for me. I mean...shit. This goes back to the issue of needing DM's though, because constant PvP with other players for the sake of dick measuring is not interesting. Let me just bang out a few for instances:

- rumors of Triumvirate attempts to have Sandro killed were circulating and added tension and fear, then fizzled out

- rumors of Triumvirate attempts to reclaim Aquor and drive the Red Wizards out of the valley were circulating, then fizzled out

- Sandro was arrested during a very heated exchange at the Second Wind about one of our Knights and our slave-gladiator, and was released pending a trial that never happened

- Numerous big changes to Aquor have been put forward to change the political landscape there, which would require a hearty amount of bloodshed, but have not moved at all

All of these examples were steeped in faction conflict, but were RPed out instead of just toggle hostile pew pew pew. That means the resolution required either high ranking faction leadership (and possibly DM approval) or direct DM intervention. DM time is at a premium, meaning the resolutions are slow to come since no one player can hog all the DM time.

As more and more players hit 20+ and grow into reputable members of factions, it seems fewer conflicts are resolved simply via combat. That is actually a testament to how good the RP is on Sundren, because it would be so easy to solve our problems with violence (all my listed examples could have been resolved with no more than 6 brutal murders each) but we all get how our actions reflect on our factions and complicate matters and chaos theory and butterfly wings and whatnot. This is creating a looooooong lag time between creation of conflict and resolution, and players are growing bored or frustrated. You all keep saying "make posts, make requests, pester us" but when the response rate on forum posts is somewhere around 25% it is hard to stay motivated to type all that stuff and then hope it sticks. I am not calling you out or criticizing here, you guys are volunteers and your every second is appreciated, but I think the system could use evaluation. Maybe a ticket system or something, so posts can't just get lost in the ether? Maybe a few more Jr DM's to help run more routine stuff? Maybe perm everyone and ask them if anyone else has more critiques, to discourage future grumblings? I dunno.

[gamestarmike]

yfw nothing will come of this thread now, thanks Dean

[Orlitoq]

Typed up so much, then deleted it... Pretty much anything I was going to write has been said here already.

Great insight by those above, and it is encouraging to hear the staff share their concerns as well.

[Talleyman99]

a tldr response.

I love sundren, it is a very well put together server that offers a lot of great things on the development side. Even as of late, more great areas, and great changes put together by the staff.

As of late I think the servers short coming is is story. The seconds sundering happened, the city flew and then........ nothing. The orcs that where only sent to lick there wounds poofed from the land scape, the emperor and his grand plans for the valley went on vacation. The feeling of a gritty and unsafe land slipped away and fell back into pre-second sundering ways. It was nice that Factions where pushed to the for front to shape the valley, but we still needs that under layer to react to, we need non player made story to react to.

Also Something I've felt sundren lacks in a real boogie man. That evil thing Dm's can log in and spring as the bad guy every time and feel comfortable doing so. Can't say this is the blackhand they have taken on a more "faction" status with claiming Sestra Also boogie men need to be something even the bad guys hate Imo. ((city ripped a deep hole in the ground it might be to main stream but there is a Underdark full of bad guys the Chaotic kind that would clash nicely with Sundrens Lawful bent))

So last thing is I feel and it's probably far from true... but It seems like all events only happen when requested, players have to request and lay out a story before it happens. I personally dont like asking for events I like to be apart of something that feels more spontaneous.

If nothing changed everything I voiced above never happened I still play here. I like this server these are just feelings and views. In the past some of the things where not as much a deal or a deal at all. In time im sure the pendulum will swing again.

[GodBeastX]

Tes: i stick my fingers in ur wetness

Off top for great justice.

Satoshi, you brought back the epic one XD

In case it wasn't clear to everybody, I was joking by the way I mostly been busy with lots of things NOT Sundren. Not that I am trying to distance myself from Sundren. Just saying I been busy!

Edit:

Oh, forgot a GIF. Here's me looking at most people who wanna ERP.

[Vladadier]

I think the issue is the broken DMbiceditor... GIVE VLAD HIS TAIL!!! lol... For myself I burned myself out playing so much... So I've been playing some older RPG's. Xenoblade Chronicles to be exact, but I still tend to sit in AFK incase people need/want to speak with me

[GodBeastX]

I think the issue is the broken DMbiceditor... GIVE VLAD HIS TAIL!!! lol... For myself I burned myself out playing so much... So I've been playing some older RPG's. Xenoblade Chronicles to be exact, but I still tend to sit in AFK incase people need/want to speak with me

BIC Editor should be fixed now.

[OnyxTigress]

What about getting the stat bonuses to those who need it? Is that fixed yet?

[GodBeastX]

This... is going to make you laugh... but ... I'm considering putting normal human back and just popping up a UI to ask what stat you want. It's cake to code... but I'm weighing it in my mind.

[OnyxTigress]

Anything that'd give the stats would please me, since it's been a long time since it's been working.

[Lotus]

The broken .bic editor was the issue preventing the conversion of standard humans to the subrace variants. It's better now.

[Battlecaster]

I'm dredging this thread back up --

-- as is surely my prerogative as a new player who doesn't know any better?

A lot of salient points were raised here, but the one I most agree with is that players are ultimately best-served when they are acting (as opposed to reacting). After all, you'll rarely find success, anywhere, in waiting for something to happen.

In this regard, I've always found it dangerous to rely on DMs and DM campaigns. As part-time volunteers, the DMs most likely cannot always dedicate the time that's required to consistently oversee an overarching campaign. As wardens of the server's population, DMs are also accountable to the player base at large.

This last point, married to the first point, is likely why it's not always easy for DMs to support personal player plots over time.

Which brings me to the message I'm getting at. I've only been here for about a week, myself, and I am still in newbie status. I can rest anywhere I want (like a boss), I freak out when something with a green or a blue name comes running at me, and I am having a hard time figuring out where this or that place is -- or who this or that lord is.

But the one thing I have figured out is that if you want roleplay, the place to go is the Second Wind Inn. But the roleplay I've found there has been largely social in nature. Which is great for me, because I feel like I'm like a master-class spy, just sitting there and absorbing tons of information. But for the players who have been there and done that?

It might help to shake things up a little bit by stepping out of your comfort zone? To begin pushing your agendas on other players, or on the game world at large? I am probably out of line in saying so, but I sort of imagine that the stagnation some people are feeling has a lot to do with players simply treading water, and walking the path of least resistance.

If Sundren is starving, why aren't the Ilmatari or some other goodly order, trying to do something about it? If your character's business contract is held up in red-tape, why aren't they seeking alternative contracts, fresh contacts, and new markets with other characters or via the forum (which is an easy way to let the DMs know what you're up to without needing them immediately in-game)?

Maybe a lot of this is already happening, and maybe that's part of the core issue with the server's faltering population? But so far the only active, open plotting and player engagement that I've seen -- if you'll forgive me the name drop here -- is Maverick Bell's canvassing the server's "VIPs" for donations towards his museum project.

So keep that up, Maverick. I hope to be doing the same as soon as I am caught up on all of the server lore. I may be level five, but who needs to be level twenty to rock a little old boat? All you have to do is move back and forth, back and forth, and all the waves will start to happen . . .

Too long? Didn't read? The crux: If you're feeling stagnant, start a new plot, roll a new character, or try a new idea that doesn't even require a DM's buy-in or a staff member's thumbs up. You might be surprised with where it goes. And if you're still disappointed at the end of your experiment? At least you can say that you put in the effort to make things happen before you graciously bow out?