Make the Ethereal spells grant Invisibility.

[sonuvalich]

Agree with Thaelis. Since we can't use it to walk through walls or go mug ethereal filchers for their phat loot, we could at least use a 7th lvl. spell to some powerful effect. I would be fine with summoning/casting hostile spells breaking it, but buffing and/or running seems like a good alternative use. I also would not object to it not granting immunity vs. force effects.

[GodBeastX]

Ethereal is something I hate in NWN2 because it doesn't work like it's supposed to. It puts you on another plane, but things CAN affect that plane which don't.

The Ethereal Plane

The Ethereal Plane is coexistent with the Material Plane and often other planes as well. The Material Plane itself is visible from the Ethereal Plane, but it appears muted and indistinct, its colors blurring into each other and its edges turning fuzzy.

While it is possible to see into the Material Plane from the Ethereal Plane, the Ethereal Plane is usually invisible to those on the Material Plane. Normally, creatures on the Ethereal Plane cannot attack creatures on the Material Plane, and vice versa. A traveler on the Ethereal Plane is invisible, incorporeal, and utterly silent to someone on the Material Plane.

The Ethereal Plane is mostly empty of structures and impediments. However, the plane has its own inhabitants. Some of these are other ethereal travelers, but the ghosts found here pose a particular peril to those who walk the fog.
It has the following traits.

No gravity.
Alterable morphic. The plane contains little to alter, however.
Mildly neutral-aligned.
Normal magic. Spells function normally on the Ethereal Plane, though they do not cross into the Material Plane.

The only exceptions are spells and spell-like abilities that have the force descriptor and abjuration spells that affect ethereal beings. Spellcasters on the Material Plane must have some way to detect foes on the Ethereal Plane before targeting them with force-based spells, of course. While it’s possible to hit ethereal enemies with a force spell cast on the Material Plane, the reverse isn’t possible. No magical attacks cross from the Ethereal Plane to the Material Plane, including force attacks.

So, you are NOT immortal going to ethereal plane in P&P, people can detect you, then blast you with force spells, or other things. You also can have your butt handed to you by things on the ethereal plane. Guess what else runs around on ethereal planes? DEMONS!

[Saulus]

How about just a random chance when you go ethereal that a demon spawns and attacks you.

[sonuvalich]

How about just a random chance when you go ethereal that a demon spawns and attacks you.

Even though it sounds like dirty mudblood wild magic, I say yes.

[Valhalla]

I also would not object to it not granting immunity vs. force effects.

Force effects and abjurations affect an ethereal creature normally. Their effects extend onto the Ethereal Plane from the Material Plane, but not vice versa.

Bold mine. Because the lols of hitting someone with a Mordes while they're in the middle of a 10-round buffing process while Ethereal is... pretty strong.

[prismaticcrow]

I would have to go with agreeing that it should make you invisible as well. I mean, why not? IC you're not supposed to be reacting to ethereal characters anyway, may as well make the ugly blue characters vanish. True seeing and such would still reveal that they are around, which is canon.

If more effort was to be put into the spell, than I'd agree that adding summons to break the effect is acceptable, as well as still being affected by force spells, but I don't know if thats possible to script. If it's not, then just make it easy: make 'em invisible and call it a day.

[kuscotopia]

I've seen at least five times in the last week an arcanist being assaulted full-frontal, without their buffs up, and a singular spell allowed them to walk away unhindered. Which 'walk away' option does a fighter get, exactly?

Items. Most of the toons I encounter spamming etherealness do so via an item, UMD or otherwise.

I don't mean to start a flame war between the melee vs casters. My primary is a spirit shaman and I hate dealing with etherealness too, I just prefer to lobby for additive balancing rather than subtractive.

So, rather than stripping away at Etherealness can we instead provide new counters to it? What about something akin to dimensional anchor? Might help a few of us finally be able to deal with that pesky nexus.

[ManUtd4Ever]

Rather than stripping away at Etherealness can we instead provide new counters to it?

This is a brilliant idea so long as a melee character is capable of wielding the item or acquiring the skill/feat necessary to make it so. [But, if this were the case then please understand this too would require the casting classes to adopt new tactics. So in the end, does it accomplish anything?]

Cheers!

[kuscotopia]

Aye, of course. I imagine these sorts of items could show up in faction stores, similar to those Rings of the Ram the Triads enjoy.

I readily admit that I am biased, Etherealness is my preferred class's 17th level ability.

[Lotus]

Rings of the Ram the Triads enjoy

Legion item, disposed of a while ago.

[Bloodriki]

Normal magic. Spells function normally on the Ethereal Plane, though they do not cross into the Material Plane.

If I'm reading this correctly, wouldn't one who cast spells (buff,haste,etc) in incorporeal form be stripped of that magic in the transition back to the material realm?

If one knew the dangers of spelunking through the ethereal plane, would they make a habit of doing it? Sounds like the clever caster would use it as a last resort for truly desperate situations, like escaping shackle and cell to avoid execution or something.

Also, I'm fairly certain Legionnaires get rings of the ram - not the Triad.

[ManUtd4Ever]

The root of the issue is whether or not "buffing" is considered an offensive act. If so, then IAW Etherealness spell description: Attacking or performing a hostile action will make the Etherealness vanish.


In Sundren, "Buffing" or preparing for battle is considered a hostile action. Should a possible opponent begin buffing, you may immediately flag them hostile and begin PvP, bypassing any need for making them aware of impending attacks.

This is why any spells cast while in Etherealness, if you are toggled hostile, should immediately pull you out of the spell.

Cheers!

[kuscotopia]

certain Legionnaires get rings of the ram - not the Triad.

My bad.

[Laurk]

Ethereal is something I hate in NWN2 because it doesn't work like it's supposed to. It puts you on another plane, but things CAN affect that plane which don't.

This is why they just called it "Greater Sanctuary" in NWN 1. simple. better. It acts exactly like sanctuary and NOTHING like Ethrealness. Even attacking breaks it just like Sanctuary. It "is" Sanctuary... they just decided to call it Ethrealness for some insane reason I cannot comprehend. You can't levitate any direction. You can't be targeted by force effects. You CAN be hit by AoE spells. You CAN be hit by whirldwind attack. You don't get mobbed by denizens of the Ethreal plane, and you cannot pass through walls and doors. There is almost nothing that the NWN2 version has in common with the Ethrealness spell in PnP, so why do we RP it as Ethrealness instead of Sanctuary?

I RP it that way whenever players im with don't object. Ethrealness is pretty much my most important spell as it lets me heal in combat without getting ruined, and without having to chug 20 invis potions on each adventure. To me, simply replacing the word "Ethreal Jaunt" with "Greater Sanctuary" and "Etherealness" with "Mass Greater Sanctuary" is the most simple and intuititive fix you can get. It literally fixes every problem with this spell (including that you don't vanish as Sanctuary doesn't make you invis) without changing a single line of code. Heck if players just agree to RP it that way, you don't even have to fix the name.

[Lotus]

Yet another reason any spell casting should break etherealness. Thanks.