Gate Spell

[thaelis]

Firstly, I love how cool this spell is, and that it has multiple choices of summon based on your alignment!

My suggestion is this: In Pnp you can either choose to subjugate the summoned creature for 1 round/level without needing to bargain with it or offer it tribute. However, longer terms of service can be bargained for!

I would suggest giving the caster two options when casting the spell. The normal option would still cost 500gp as currently, but there would also be a min/level option costing 5000gp minus the caster's Diplomacy skill*50gp.

Mainly I'm suggesting this because these summons are so damn awesome, and it'd be great if they could stick around for a whole dungeon crawl and fight alongside your party! (arguably it wouldn't be worth it at this cost but meh)

[[DM] Grinning Death]

I can see so much abuse springing from that. Being able to use that summon for so long for an amount of gold that small wouldn't be worth it, because you can make three times that in Whurest by using the spell. It'd only promote solo'ing, in my opinion.

[Torgar]

As one of the more experience whurest runners on the server, you max out, with a good loot room, at about 12k gold, and that's with REALLY good loot drops in the final room, and on the way there. Considering diplomacy isn't a class skill for half the classes that can take the spell, and the other half don't put points into it, having a minor offset of gold from a baseline of 5k or something isn't really that crazy. And the duergar in the final room can and likely will still wreck that summon 4v1 if someone is trying to solo. And if someone is soloing and can't get the final room, then the gold gain is about 6k-7k, which is only a little more then the spell costs, and less then if they didn't use it and just used a group.

IMHO, I think a min/level version for a 5k cost is just fine, since you don't really make gold off of it solo, and if you are in a group, the summon usually gets in the way of the real warriors who are better buffed then the pet anyways.

[Valhalla]

Not to mention a lot of summons can be dispelled with Mord's (not sure about Gate right off), which the Alhoon casts, and the Clerics in Mossdale spam Dismissal if you've got an outsider summon out.

[sonuvalich]

Gate as a summoning spell should technically be a permanent/as-long-as-you-agree-to summon by PnP rules when summoning a single creature into contracted service. It does cost 1,000 xp and require the establishment of terms and conditions. In lieu of that, what if the spell was made min/level or hr/level, but took some of your vitality as the currency for the transaction? You give some of your life force for the prolonged service of a powerful extraplanar creature...it sounds pretty standard. If it was something like 5-10 vit (more than the 4 you can simply drink back) it adds a serious risk for using the spell repeatedly as a solo grinding tool.

[Shadechild]

Isn't gate supposed to Hold or Stun Outsiders when it's cast on them? Maybe make it dominate an outsider its cast on? (Will Save)

Or was that the "Planar Binding" tree.

[sonuvalich]

Those are planar binding. The other function of gate is to make a Stargate to another plane.

[Shadechild]

I wouldn't mind seeing a longer Gate Duration, to make it more feasible. But permanency is a little weird considering the Summon has to stay in its Binding Circle? Aren't most of the major Wizard flops from ruining the binding circle and the Demon/Devil mauling them to death? =0

[sonuvalich]

That might have been 2nd ed, or maybe just Baldur's Gate...I remember some game making you cast prot. from evil before summoning or the devil would tear you apart.

Here is the 3.5 version:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Gate

and the Pathfinder version, which is mostly the same sans xp cost, a gold cost, and some HD limits for the summon:
http://paizo.com/prd/spells/gate.html

[Shadechild]

That might have been 2nd ed, or maybe just Baldur's Gate...I remember some game making you cast prot. from evil before summoning or the devil would tear you apart.

Here is the 3.5 version:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Gate

and the Pathfinder version, which is mostly the same sans xp cost, a gold cost, and some HD limits for the summon:
http://paizo.com/prd/spells/gate.html

NWN1 and Baldurs Gate required Protection from Evil or it was Hostile =)

If you choose to call a kind of creature instead of a known individual you may call either a single creature (of any HD) or several creatures. You can call and control several creatures as long as their HD total does not exceed your caster level. In the case of a single creature, you can control it if its HD do not exceed twice your caster level. A single creature with more HD than twice your caster level can’t be controlled. Deities and unique beings cannot be controlled in any event. An uncontrolled being acts as it pleases, making the calling of such creatures rather dangerous. An uncontrolled being may return to its home plane at any time.

I never knew Gate was a neat spell like this.

[sonuvalich]

I wanted to have Pathfinder's babies just for taking out all the damned xp costs for spells, crafting, etc. I never used those spells or made many items for my parties simply because I did not feel it fair that I had to lose xp so my fighter could save gold on some fancy sword or armor.

[Dispater]

I wouldn't be opposed if there were a vitality cost as well as the gp cost for the longer duration summoning.

[thaelis]

In lieu of that, what if the spell was made min/level or hr/level, but took some of your vitality as the currency for the transaction? You give some of your life force for the prolonged service of a powerful extraplanar creature...it sounds pretty standard. If it was something like 5-10 vit (more than the 4 you can simply drink back) it adds a serious risk for using the spell repeatedly as a solo grinding tool.

Vitality drain would be fine by me! It's not something you'd want to do every day, its jus something that would be cool to be able to do, especially in big PvP battles. Having armies of Balors vs. army of celestials, and not have them wink out in a couple rounds time.

I'd think the evil summons would drain slightly more vitality though? (I also suspect the Evil summon is more powerful though as its CR 20 vs the Planetar's CR 16?)

[Talleyman99]

These spells dont need to be longer then round per lvl. Anything longer then that lets you have "powerful" creatures that you buff and solo with. As for pvp it's over in 20 rounds anyways, why does the summon or gated creature need to last longer then that? yes i know not all summons bindings, gates, and creates are not created equally. Infact make the create undeads last 1 round per lvl too so they are all even.

[Cornuto]

Vitality drain would be fine by me! It's not something you'd want to do every day, its jus something that would be cool to be able to do, especially in big PvP battles. Having armies of Balors vs. army of celestials, and not have them wink out in a couple rounds time.

I'd think the evil summons would drain slightly more vitality though? (I also suspect the Evil summon is more powerful though as its CR 20 vs the Planetar's CR 16?)

I made the Gate summons identical in CR stats and abilities save for alignment based things.

Example (Numbers made up, can't remember what they actually are):
Balor has like 2d4 v. good,
Planetar has 2d4 versus evil
Concordant Killer covers both but to a lesser extent with 1d6 vs. Evil AND 1d6 vs. Good