Doomguides shouldn't fade away

[Torgar]

I was wondering what the rest of you, especially the staff, thought of the idea of another deity picking up the mantle of god of the Doomguide PRC, and I thought that Hoar would be a very viable choice.

Here me out on this one. Hoar is the god of poetic justice and revenge. Kelemvor was killed by Myrkul, and it would make complete sense that in revenge for it, Hoar would pick up the Doomguides and re-empower them so they can continue to take revenge on Myrkul and his plans for the death of their god.

Personally, I really love the doomguide class. It's RP fluff has always been awesome to me, and it's not an OP prestige for clerics like so many can be. It can turn a lot, sure, but it get's less hp, so it evens out. And getting to see someone in this dark armor, who's only mission is the process of sending the dying and the undead to their judgement in the fugue is just cool, in my opinion.

So, what do you all think? I'd really like to see the Doomguide PRC not fade away. It's a core NWN2 PRC that actually works without being buggy, there's no reason to kick it to the curb.

Thanks for your time reading.

[[DM] Grinning Death]

I don't know if Hoar would have the power to do so, really. He's a demi-power, isn't he? Would he be able to pick up that many of Kelemvor's former followers?

[Kangleton]

Make it Cyric.

[roguethree]

I don't know if Hoar would have the power to do so, really. He's a demi-power, isn't he? Would he be able to pick up that many of Kelemvor's former followers?

Less feasible things have happened here.

[Kaybrie]

Picking up that many followers would be a boon to his power so far as I'm aware, and could potentially elevate him to a lesser deity as a result. Bare in mind, Kelemvorites who survived and withheld their faith are actively hunted/killed by the Black Hand for Blasphemy against Myrkul's church. I wouldn't imagine the whole of his faith would still be alive.

Aside from a handful of scattered temples, the church of Hoar is composed primarily of lone wanderers who travel the realms, agreeing to pray for Hoar's aid on behalf of those who seek or fear vengeance, in exchange for a small fee. Charlatans who would try to scam people in this manner quickly feel the punishment of Hoar. His followers seek out victims of injustice, hear and appraise their stories, and track down the perpetrators in order to inflict a fitting form of punishment. No injustice is too small or too large for revenge to be sought and a fitting punishment meted out, earning the church of Hoar the ire of town watches and Tyrists alike as well as the adulation of the downtrodden.

If anything, from an RP perspective it makes perfect sense for Hoar to be getting new disciples from Kelemvor's broken church, it'd only be befitting that he take on the class.

[Kaizen]

I still don't actually understand WTF happened with Kelemvor.

He died?

Is that possible?

I thought that as long as people knew about/who the God was, he/she/it continued to exist?

There's that section in the books where clerics can still worship 'dead' gods as it were, but they didn't actually recieve divine intervention like the others. Or something.

And the only god to truly 'die' was when that elf mage rid the world of all knowledge of it.

[[DM] Grinning Death]

Knowing who he was doesn't change the fact that he was defeated and killed by Mykul. It's one of the ways that Ao has allowed gods to change portfolios among themselves, and is what happened to Kelemvor in the Sundren setting.

And yeah, I can see a surge of Hoar worship taking place, as a lot of the former followers would likely be looking to fight back.

[Kaizen]

Didn't a powerless and dead Myrkul (before he 'killed' Kelemvor) and Bhaal grant powers to casters on this server?

[[DM] Grinning Death]

The cult of Myrkul didn't start granting spells until the Crown of Horns was found and brought in. It contained a large portion of divine essence combined with sponsorship from Bane and his worshipers. This gave him enough divine 'mojo' to come back and kick Kelemvor's ass. Bhaal currently cannot grant spells or anything else, because he lacks the divine power to do so.

Plus, whatever the DM says, goes.

That being said, I think this is an excellent idea for the class. We'll see what the rest of the staff thinks.

[Torgar]

As an aside, I would like to give official credit for the idea of Hoar to Kasso, whom is the one that suggested to me some weeks ago that he would be a good idea for it. Kudos to that.

[Shedboy]

Ideas:

1. Tyr could take up the mantle - he is the Judge supreme. Provide Law to the living and the dead. Messing around with a body alive or dead without consent is trespass to person.

2. Provide provision for a Triumvirate Patriach a demi power / exarch with the Kelemvors old portfolio. Provided they do a epic quest.

3. Helm could add guardian, watcher, protector of Tombs to his portfolio and take the Prc on.

4. Make it an open Prc to all good aligned faiths that have some stake in the dead staying dead. Lathander was always a good one for undead slaying, and i note in 2n ed dnd, Lathander's morninglord were uber at turning undead. There is quite a interest in Lathander on the server at this time - could be nice to promote that faith.

As for Hoar - not sure why he would he care if Kelemvor got gibbed? Myrkul was just taking back what was his to begin... and after all kelemvor indirectly helped cyric steal myrkuls throne. i really cant see the poetry in it. Myrkul killed kelemvor. Not sure what was unjust about that seeing as its the Grand Law of the gods that the lord of death should try and kill everything as part of his role.

Lord Ao i.e. the dm's may think differently. But return of the PRC seems a reasonable proposal.

[Shedboy]

Ideas:

1. Tyr could take up the mantle - he is the Judge supreme. Provide Law to the living and the dead. Messing around with a body alive or dead without consent is trespass to person.

2. Provide provision for a Triumvirate Patriach a demi power / exarch with the Kelemvors old portfolio. Provided they do a epic quest.

3. Helm could add guardian, watcher, protector of Tombs to his portfolio and take the Prc on.

4. Make it an open Prc to all good aligned faiths that have some stake in the dead staying dead. Lathander was always a good one for undead slaying, and i note in 2n ed dnd, Lathander's morninglord were uber at turning undead. There is quite a interest in Lathander on the server at this time - could be nice to promote that faith.

As for Hoar - not sure why he would he care if Kelemvor got gibbed? Myrkul was just taking back what was his to begin... and after all kelemvor indirectly helped cyric steal myrkuls throne. i really cant see the poetry in it. Myrkul killed kelemvor. Not sure what was unjust about that seeing as its the Grand Law of the gods that the lord of death should try and kill everything as part of his role.

Lord Ao i.e. the dm's may think differently. But return of the PRC seems a reasonable proposal.

[Kaybrie]

As for Hoar - not sure why he would he care if Kelemvor got gibbed? Myrkul was just taking back what was his to begin... and after all kelemvor indirectly helped cyric steal myrkuls throne. i really cant see the poetry in it. Myrkul killed kelemvor. Not sure what was unjust about that seeing as its the Grand Law of the gods that the lord of death should try and kill everything as part of his role.

The injustice is upon the followers, not the god. I doubt myself Hoar would give two shits about Myrkul on a personal level, what I could see him caring about would be all the injustices being committed against his clergy, which is what this thread is about. In turn it makes sense for the Kelemvorites to turn to Hoar, given that they'd feel like they'd be wronged on that level. It's an easy, smooth transition from one vengeful vs undead lawful neutral deity, to another Lawful Neutral deity who's vengeful against injustices.

It also brings to mind interesting events and roleplay that could be created from it.

[roguethree]

that the lord of death should try and kill everything as part of his role.

Lord of the dead. Myrkul's bag isn't making people die; death's inevitable, so he waits. He's patient as hell.

[Redjack]

Why not Jergal? Looks like he wouldn't be happy with undead walking around.