Level caps on certain areas

[Sir Kharn]

This kind of idea doesn't help the problem of melee characters being unable to really contribute in situations like this. Crit-immune enemies make things pretty much a no-go for most non-casters. So, we're forced to go elsewhere.

You know...i got really annoyed at a certain vampire (you know who you are) so i have found a rather nasty way to counter a few setbacks i was having in my battles with him....all done thru loads of RP and questing that has so far taken a total of 2 months to realize.
My point is that no matter who the the toon is and what class there is ALWAYS a way to counter it.....if your willing to think it out and put the work in.

[GodBeastX]

I used a single spell as an example (Not a class), and not to prove my point, but to give a simple to follow example. I can tell you that only one of out the 5 planned dungeons have crit immune enemies, and that's the vampires which will end up CR 14 - 16 anyway.

Being that I used a spell in my example, that doesn't just mean you have to be a caster. I know many non-casters that have UMD skill points.

If you locked your character into "If I can't crit the enemy it's not worth fighting" then I'd just call that a 1 trick pony and you may find yourself useless in more places than you can imagine I for one would never build any character based on requiring crits/sneak attacks to do anything.

Rogues for example have many damage dealing tools such as traps, UMD, etc, which can function without a crit ever landing. You should see how much damage a holy trap does to undead (6d4 (8d10 if undead) divine for a strong one).

You also can't say "Makes many of us comparitively weaker" and expect it to mean anything to me. I've already shown a rogue who would be quite fine in a crit immune environment. What % of players are we speaking of in this case? How many actual people would find themselves being useless to a party? I thought even 4 damage an attack was better than 0 for a party, considering having 3 people even if one is doing only 4 damage is better than 2, even for rewards.

I also don't expect everyone to be totally effective in every scenario, it's part of the reason we even put the dark advent lair in for low levels, because some people can kill ghosts, zombies, and skeletons easier than lizard men and goblins. It depends on your character alone.

[Fezzik]

On that note, one thing pops to mind about the area level caps, though. Would that not keep the higher level defenders out, too? That could pose a problem in and of itself.

You might have missed it in the flury of posts ... I mistyped/spoke, I was considering it more CR, not a level cap like we used to have (when those 12th+ level rangers and druids were not allowed in the Virdale for more than really really fast trips to the Glade


ps. to GBX ... Cybil is a one trick pony ... she bitch slaps everything she sees... she does rather well at it too

[Nil]

Some good points

I could counter this, but I shouldn't have brought it up in the first place. It was way off topic for the thread. Sorry about that.

[Cornuto]

Rogues for example have many damage dealing tools such as traps, UMD, etc, which can function without a crit ever landing. You should see how much damage a holy trap does to undead (6d4 (8d10 if undead) divine for a strong one).
...

I've already shown a rogue who would be quite fine in a crit immune environment.

Deadly holy trap --------------------------1,000g+
Money Earned from kill -----------------------20g
------------------------------------------------
Rogue is quite fine in sneak immune environment

[GodBeastX]

If getting traps is a problem, let me know. I havn't gotten around to digging through ease of gaining every possible item yet. I've done some work on brewing potions and crafting wands, but other things may need work.

[Fezzik]

OOoo... it might be worth crafting wands and potions now? Youpie!

[Intrepid42]

OOoo... it might be worth crafting wands and potions now? Youpie!

There is some benefit in making certain of those things already. For example, a paladin with the brew feat can make potions of Holy Weapon very cost-effectively.

[roguethree]

Nope. Brew Potion only goes up to 3rd level spells. You mean Bless Weapon?

[Intrepid42]

Nope. Brew Potion only goes up to 3rd level spells. You mean Bless Weapon?

Yes, Bless Weapon. My bad.

[nezzerscape]

Hmmm, this thread has gone so many directions...

I think that gold/XP per kill should go hand-in-hand for everywhere (save one). I think there should be one place that treasure can be found for uber toons…. Rooms, healing, donations, enhancements… all cost but make that area a level 20+ one; ALL other areas based on the XP/level mechanics that are put into place.

I like that I get nothing for lower level areas… there is not reason for me to be there and if there is its RPing and when RPing, it is its own reward. There are many ventures I go on and get little gold/XP for the time put in. If I want to grind I would not be here. That said I love my fighter and without serious investments she cannot go most places save for groups (her level and several lower)… that is why she has not leveled with her peers. Many of the toons she ventured with at 5th level are now 5 or more levels above her. That is ok, she can still walk up to a campfire and talk of old times with them. I thought it funny when other toons who I have been recently traveling with say you know so and so. It was nice to say yes I carried their half dead body many times out of the _____.

Now I am one the side of “everyone else is better that my fighter because she cannot solo” (and yes I would like some cheese with my wine)… however without her aid many clerics/wagers could not go to certain areas due to damage output. Yes she cannot solo, but it’s better with others!

As far as uber toons guarding their HQ and avoiding them… I must say that I have avoided those areas on an occasion. I would love to go head to head with them doing what is right IC (for all of 10-20 seconds) but my concern is that a NPC will land the final blow and that is no fun! Yes, yes, I know do not get attached to your toon, it is all part of the game.

Nez