The Elven Azuth Cleric Rule Bending Thread

[Xeesheava]

Today while I was taking a shower... I realized this:

Azuth Cleric Domains: Magic, Knowledge, Trickery

Magic Domain Spells:

1 Mage Armor
2 Melf's Acid Arrow
3 Assay Resistance
5 Dispel Magic, Greater
6 Spell Mantle
8 Blackstaff

And now there is the interesting part:

Prestige Class: Arcane Archer

Requirements
· Race: Elf or Half-Elf
· Base Attack Bonus: +6
· Feats: Point Blank Shot, Weapon Focus (Longbow or Shortbow).
· Spellcasting: Ability to cast 1st level arcane spells.

--

So, my question is: Why an Azuth Elven Cleric can't take this prestige class even when they have the ability to cast 1st level Arcane Spells (Mage Armor)?
And: It's possible to fix this to be done in Sundren?

Thanks for reading.

[DM_Equinox]

Because, even if the spell is technically a wizard/sorcerer spell, it is a deity who grants it to the cleric, hence it is by definition divine, not arcane.

[Kaeldorn]

That's a misconception. The cleric can't cast any arcane spells, he is merely granted the power by his god to produce certain magical effects from a divine source that are normally only possible to create with arcane magic. As such, they're still divine spells and not arcane spells.

Bah. Equinox beat me to it

[Xeesheava]

Because, even if the spell is technically a wizard/sorcerer spell, it is a deity who grants it to the cleric, hence it is by definition divine, not arcane.

But, with that argument a Faithless Bard or a simple Bard can't cast divine spells such as Cure Minor Wounds, because the bard only mimic arcane runes to cast spells. In this case, the Cleric can mimic the runes of an arcane spell, but it's not really a divine spell only for being granted by a god, the Cleric must mold the wave of Mystra to cast the Mage Armor. Or so I tought...

[Kaeldorn]

the Cleric must mold the wave of Mystra to cast the Mage Armor. Or so I tought...

You thought wrongly

The bard's cure wounds spells are arcane also, not divine.

Although there are divine casting bards, but they are alternative class options.

[Cornuto]

Its not an arcane spell as its still prayed for and received from a deity. For example if it were an arcane spell you couldn't cast it in full plate armor.

[Xeesheava]

Although there are divine casting bards, but they are alternative class options.

[Formaly asks to know more about that]

Regarding the OT: It's ok, the Domains spells are not Arcane.

Case Closed.

[Kaeldorn]

From: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/cl...terclasses.htm

Bard Variant: Divine Bard
Not all bards are arcanists; some derive their special powers from a divine tradition. In many primitive cultures, the divine bard takes the place of the cleric or the adept as the guide of the people's religious beliefs.

Class Features
The divine bard has all the standard bard class features, except as noted below.

Spellcasting
A divine bard learns and casts spells as a normal bard, with some minor exceptions. A divine bard's spells are divine spells, not arcane spells.

To learn or cast a spell, a divine bard must have a Wisdom score (not Charisma score) equal to at least 10 + the spell level. All other Spellcasting factors, including bonus spells and save DCs, are still determined using the divine bard's Charisma score.

Like druids, paladins, and rangers, divine bards need not designate a specific deity as the source of their spells. However, a divine bard can't cast spells of an alignment that doesn't match his. Thus, divine bards cannot cast lawful spells (since bards can't be lawful). Neutral divine bards can't cast any spells associated with an alignment (and are thus relatively rare).

Add the following spells to the divine bard's class spell list: 0—create water, cure minor wounds; 1st—detect evil/good/law, protection from evil/good/law; 2nd—consecrate, desecrate, gentle repose; 3rd—magic circle against evil/good/law, prayer; 4th—remove disease, speak with dead, sending; 5th—divination, restoration; 6th—commune, hallow, unhallow, raise dead.

[Thief Of Navarre]

Divine bards use their wisdom score? curious since the whole concept of the bard is to be a charismatic scoundrel isnt it! (I know there are many types of bard)

I suppose they would play out ability wise just like a cleric except they probably have sing songs around the campfire instead of prayers. It would certainly confuse someone you attack if they have arcane spell resistance and your still bursting their eardrums

[Azulfae]

To many smart arses in this thread for me.

Divine casters cast divine spells and arcane casters cast arcane spells.

There are no technicalities or loop holes.

[DM_Equinox]

I believe the original question has been answered. Before the tone suffers, I'm closing it.