Alignments - Get over it!

[GodBeastX]

Getting VERY sick about the black and white attitude of alignments on Sundren. People blame D&D, but it's the RP'ers in D&D that decide the effect of alignments.

Neutral, neutral abstains from Good and Evil or jumps back and forth. Realize what this means please. This means you will likely not be involved in situations if you can help it or unable to commit to a defined state.

Evil does NOT mean you do not care about anything or are emotionless, and Good does not mean you run around trying to wipe out evil.

Stop reading D&D books and look at real life. You have no idea who is good or evil and even you could be one or the other. Get over it and just play the person. The only people I should see getting so black and white are paladin/black guards.

[Leevoth]

What about clerics?

[deepshades]

Err.. GBX if I knew you were going to boot me for the rest of the night over a 10 minute argument I would have just shutup.

I didn't mean to press you that far in that discussion.

Well .. I guess thats my sunday night. I'll go find something else to do. 0.o

I just get overly passionate about slavery being wrong. The Thayan bit just pushed me over the edge again.

Once again I'm sorry

[Rhifox]

Neutral = accepting the status quo, no matter what it is.

Good and Evil are acting, Neutral is not-acting. Neutral can still believe in morals, or still have evil thoughts, but unless it acts upon those thoughts, it is neutral, leaning one way or the other at best but still neutral.


As far as Thayans and slavery goes... not every Thayan or Red Wizard agrees with it. This is stated in the source books. Those that do not either learn to suppress their beliefs (the most neutral stance), treat their slaves very well (leaning good), or leave the country and the order (leaning good). Not everyone in Thay nor every Red Wizard, as with any organization or stereotype, can be painted with a single brush.

[GodBeastX]

Err.. GBX if I knew you were going to boot me for the rest of the night over a 10 minute argument I would have just shutup.

I didn't mean to press you that far in that discussion.

Well .. I guess thats my sunday night. I'll go find something else to do. 0.o

I just get overly passionate about slavery being wrong. The Thayan bit just pushed me over the edge again.

Once again I'm sorry

Consider it like P&P. Players argue with DMs, "Rocks fall, the party dies". Raising a point is fine, passionately raising a point is tolerable, fighting with me just makes me want to end the fight as quick as possible.

As Rhifox pointed out, not every Thayan is a slaver.

[deepshades]

Well at this point I should know better than to argue over such complicated topics in text...

My character views her as evil simply because she serves under the same master that forced Hlaine to do something evil. She thinks Josephine is just as capable.

So she treats them like their masters left and right arms.. and since the master is evil. Well...

Again sorry about fighting with you, I didn't realize it had gotten to that point.

[GodBeastX]

Clerics are Black & White about their god. Not alignments.

[Rhifox]

My character views her as evil simply because she serves under the same master that forced Hlaine to do something evil. She thinks Josephine is just as capable.

So she treats them like their masters left and right arms.. and since the master is evil. Well...

It's all good and well for the *character* to think that. Arguing that someone should be considered evil on their character sheet however is going overboard, especially when the character hasn't done anything yet. It's quite possible that I might eventually go evil if I am forced into that kind of situation, but not until then.

Alignment is how the character really is. Not how other characters view the character. Sylloven can view Josephine as evil, that's all fine and well, but that doesn't mean my alignment indicator is actually evil until I actually do do something that is evil.

[deepshades]

It's all good and well for the *character* to think that. Arguing that someone should be considered evil on their character sheet however is going overboard, especially when the character hasn't done anything yet. It's quite possible that I might eventually go evil if I am forced into that kind of situation, but not until then.

Alignment is how the character really is. Not how other characters view the character. Sylloven can view Josephine as evil, that's all fine and well, but that doesn't mean my alignment indicator is actually evil until I actually do do something that is evil.

I wasn't trying to get Josephine's alignment readjusted.. I was just saying that she views Josephine as being evil.

[Rhifox]

I wasn't trying to get Josephine's alignment readjusted.. I was saying that she views Josephine as being evil.

Ahh. Well I don't know the whole argument, only what I heard. I think if it was just a case of the character viewing her as something, that's fine, but it seems like you went on to arguing that you view her as evil from an OOC standpoint as well.

[deepshades]

Ahh. Well I don't know the whole argument, only what I heard. I think if it was just a case of the character viewing her as something, that's fine, but it seems like you went on to arguing that you view her as evil from an OOC standpoint as well.

Well I would... in real life I would yes. Lets not get into that, the point is I wasn't trying to use my real life opinions to alter your characters alignment.

My suggesting to change anything about Josephine was never brought up. Its not what I do.

[Rhifox]

Alright.

[GodBeastX]

This is getting off subject, slavery is not alignment. It seems like people just try to figure out who's evil and who is not all day.

[Scourn]

This is getting off subject, slavery is not alignment. It seems like people just try to figure out who's evil and who is not all day.

Agree. Its like everyone holds a microscope up to everyone else and the second you do even a little thing, its like you have been judged by a grand jury and are viewed as such regardless of anything else you do. Seen this many times here, rather silly.

[Janus]

Can't say I've ever been a big fan of alignments at all.

Trying to squeeze someone into a standardised ideal of they way their character will behave doesn't fit with good role playing (In my opinion at least).

A character is the sum of their background. If you know your characters background and I mean really know if, not just... 'well he was raised on a farm then decided he wanted to go adventuring'... then you will know your character. You will know their hopes and fears, their desires and dreams and will have a rich and diverse character to play with. This will also give a good experience for everyone who interacts with that character.

Of course there is the issue of knowing when to shut up and when not... something I don't always know... >_> <_< ... I always just figure 'DM's word is final regardless of the topic or my personal beliefs. Nice thing about GBX is that he is willing to listen and change his mind if you can convince him.

On the flip side being passionate about your character and their beliefs is a sign of a good role player *Hugs Deepshades*.