Perma-death

[[DM] Grinning Death]

Out of tenuous curiosity, I have a proposal for a few of the events that I'm going to run in the future: perma-death.

We're planning some plotlines that are going to be dangerous. Very dangerous. And I was wondering if the player population would be amenable to me offering greater rewards in return for higher risk of permanent death.

These events would be announced well beforehand, and no one would be forced to attend. But I think it might do you all some good to get that fear of death in you, even if it is on an elective basis. The relative ease in leveling, along with the benefits of retirement make new characters far more common than they used to be. It also wouldn't be death on the spot, but rather a large vitality drain (60-80).

Thoughts?

[Phantom Lamb]

Personally, I always like having this out there in events as a possibility.

That being said, a good approach might be to notify people OOCly at the start of individual events that the potential is there. They can duck out, or at least weigh the risks & consequences a little more carefully if they know this.

A challenge with this can be level disparity, too. For example, if you pitch an event and have a level 20 with a level 12 participating. The level 12 will probably get mowed over as you try to make the event challenging for the 20. Do you have thoughts on how you'd approach that?

[[DM] Grinning Death]

Likely a lesser vitality drain, than if a level 20 got killed. If the event was meant for level 20's, and the level 12 snuck in for whatever reason, they'd be subject to a lesser penalty than those who were level 20 would suffer (30-40). And, I'd make it clear the level range of the event beforehand, along with the perma-disclaimer.

But if they insisted on coming, they'd be subject to the penalty if they wanted the greater rewards.

[greypawn]

I put newly purchased games to hardcore mode, then up the difficultly. I purchase hot sauce that is marketed as painful, then put it on my hot peppers. I enjoy perma death scenarios and am willing to join with one of my current characters, or make a new one if need be.

[wangxiuming]

I'm fine with it as long as it makes sense from a story standpoint and players are aware of the possibility. That said, I personally would prefer story content as opposed to greater rewards.

[Jhickey]

I am down!

[sonuvalich]

I would like the extra risk vs. reward provided it was not a single roll of the dice sort of thing. Like if a character stepped on a hidden trap and rolls a 1 he is dead forever kind of thing. However, if the players knew there were traps and were reckless and then set off the traps and rolled the 1, that would be fine in my book. I have mixed feelings about combats that have perma-death or huge vit loss rolled into them. My PC sometimes hangs up during fights, and the lack of turn-based fighting can make things chaotic at best, and I think the death penalty for vit is already pretty solid. Again I have no objection to subtle differences, such as "if you TPK on this boss fight you are all permed, but if a few of you die then you can be raised"

[Fuzziebunny]

I have never minded perma death as long as it makes sense and is even across the board.

I like the idea of the story more then the thought of a reward. But then I have never been one to be all epic'ed out.

[Vladadier]

I'm down

[MyNameIsDave]

What happens if a level 20 character gets permakilled? Is it the same as retiring the character? I would be all for it as long as the character who got killed got some kind of kick back for the trouble (IE some of the stuff you get from the retirement of the character).

[Farmboy2003]

I don't find it easy to level. My character My'athvin is lvl 18, the highest I've done on Sundren and Nwn2. Those 18 levels took me 6 months rough estimate. I take a long time making characters. With Mhaenal I spent 2-3 months contemplating the bard class on/off untill i only last week got with a concept I liked. If he died tonight fx, Id be mighty miffed (as far you can get for losing a bunch of pixels and memory)

I'm all for HCR however. So as long as there is good warning beforehand and its large vit drains instead. Then I'd actually also start watching my vitality before an event... And not all events were permadeath-possible. Who am I kidding? I hardly join events

what about the signus? I Got one on a character, but it doesnt seem to work with the reaper no more...

[Rekov]

I have always valued the risk of perma-death for greater reward. It reminds us all that there are actually stakes, which is an important thing to remember from time to time when you have a setting with people regularly "coming back from the dead."

There are a few suggestions I would make, though. An OOC warning that a character is beginning to risk perma-death is definitely a must. I am also a huge fan of perma-death being the result of choices, not engine mechanics. Perma-death should always contribute to the story in a meaningful manner.

Good example for perma-death:
A group of players volunteer for a dangerous mission deep behind enemy lines. They receive OOC warning that perma-death is a possibility if they make unwise decisions. During the course of the mission, the players are discovered and are on the verge of being overwhelmed. One of the party elects to make a last stand so that the others can escape, and is eventually slain.

Bad example for perma-death:
In the same situation above, the players run across a small patrol of enemy soldiers and decide to ambush them. Over the course of the battle, one of the PCs gets killed by unlucky engine mechanics.

[Doubtful]

I thought all DM events were perma-death ones, everything I run certainly is! This is a perma-death server after all.

But, that doesn't mean a character will be permed for falling foul of a random spawn or random dice roll (though ultimately some fates might be decided by a last chance save). Most, if not all, perma-death situations arise at the end of a series of occurrences or choices (lets call this the Catastrophe Chain) that lead to a final climactic (for that character anyway) situation. Keep in mind though that the events may not actually be your fault, your character(s) may end up with their lives hanging in the balance as the result of another characters actions.

However, and this is important, I will never explicitly state that the situation if continued will result in perma-death. I'll drop a lot of hints, up the atmosphere text and make it clear that things are dramatic, and risky, but OOC bombshells aren't needed. After all you wouldn't expect the DM to say "If you carry on down this path you'll find great rewards!"

It's been a while since any character bit the forever dust in one of my events, but their have been some close calls.

I don't think any of the DM staff want to go around perming characters for fun and giggles (well, not all the time), but stories need to have risk and drama, something that's hollow if all your characters are immortal gods.

[GodBeastX]

I put newly purchased games to hardcore mode, then up the difficultly. I purchase hot sauce that is marketed as painful, then put it on my hot peppers. I enjoy perma death scenarios and am willing to join with one of my current characters, or make a new one if need be.

You just graduated to awesome from pretty cool. Just saying...

[Fury]

I am a big fan of perma-death scenarios, especially if you want to instill the idea that death absolutely is not a "revolving door" situation. No matter how much I may love my character, the story trumps all, and a good death is worth keeping.