Question about Immunity: Fear

[Zorkaplex]

If a player has immunity to fear, can that player be intimidated with the intimidation skill by others? Could someone please clarify this for me? How should this be represented in role play?

[Cornuto]

I'm inclined to say no.

EDIT: Previous discussion.
http://www.sundren.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10785

[Zorkaplex]

Thank you!

[07paul87]

Quick semi-related question: Does the script for intimidate factor in racial bonuses to fear saves? My halfling should get +2 to resist, right?

[Cornuto]

No idea.

[BattlePixie]

as an example, if someone tries to intimidate a paladin, the roll autofails no matter what the outcome of the roll was (at least that's what the game mechanics spits out).

[DM_Equinox]

Technically, you can't intimidate someone who is immuine - on the other hand, a successful intimidation roll can still make the fear immune person reconsider whatever he was planning to do with the intimidator. After all, the fellow looks more imposing than you thought at first, right? And while you're not afraid, it would be unwise and possibly pointless to risk injury.

Fear immunity =/= being stupid.

[Maevan2]

Fear immunity =/= being stupid.

Exactly my thoughts. A paladin will fight to death if he has to. But that doesn't mean that he will throw away his life if he doesn't have to.

[Urithrand]

You obviously haven't seen some of the paladins we've had on the server

[Machiavelli]

I can see it sort of working. For instance if you were able to make convincing and credible threats against other people, while the paladin will of course be unafraid it might make them more cautious.

Naughty person: "Get back animal loving Paladin Bob, or I'm going to blow up this cuddly kitten!" *rolls 40 intimidate*

Paladin Bob the Animal Lover: *can tell that the person means business* "I do not fear you evil doer, but I cannot endanger Fluffykins."

I'd say that you might be able to influence someone immune to fear, even though they're not actually afraid per-se.

[The Almight Red]

I'm not sure where the intimidation actually comes into play, concerning the example you gave. It's not that I disagree with the scenario, but I don't see how the mechanical roll of intimidate even need apply. Knowing someone means business of harming another seems entirely bereft of Intimidate, unless they are claiming on assaulting something unlikely.

If someone has Fluffykins strapped to a bomb or they've got a fireball prepared to smoke the cat, Intimidate doesn't really serve a purpose. The Paladin either takes it into consideration, or does not. I don't see how intimidate should really dictate that Paladin's decision, either way.

Intimidate is not used to convince someone that they're willing to go through with a gruesome act, but that they're capable of gruesome acts through their own prowess, power, or tenacity. In the example above, it's blatently obvious they're both willing and capable of killing the cat. It's a no-brainer. So then the paladin must decide whether it's an acceptable loss or not. It's not even a question of whether it's possible that the guy can kill the cat.

Adding an unnecessary roll to try to force another person's reaction seems a bit off point.

But I could see it used in a scenario where the evil-doer is attempting to puff themselves up so that the paladin believes they have the capacity to do something extraordinarily powerful and heinous. Such as, the evil vampire declares the Paladin will leave without further trespassing, lest he slaughter an entire post of Legionnaire soldiers in retribution later that night.

Most paladins are gonna go, "Yeah, sure, whatever cheeseball." But if the vampire rolls a 40 Intimidate? Yeah, then the Paladin might take a step back and wonder, "W'oh, dude, could he do this?"

I understand these things are up to debate, but that's how I see it. The power to intimidate (in D&D, that is) isn't about willingness, because you can't divine motives anyway (except through Sense Motive, and damn, that'd get convoluted). It's about proving you're an actual threat to something that people wouldn't necessarily trust at first glance.

[GodBeastX]

Sense Motives can't divine motives.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/sensemotive.htm

It's basically all about "I got this feeling something isn't right."

[The Almight Red]

I will admit the irony of you saying Sense Motive can't divine motives. The point of my statement was not to conjure up the idea that someone rolling Sense Motive can somehow read someone else's mind. It's not a spell, in that sense of divining something, as I'm pretty sure everyone is clear upon.

It was a preemptive point to consider the fact that Sense Motive does, in fact, discern motives (of a general sort) in accordance with its particular capacity. It's rather clear from the SRD link you posted, no less. So that way no one could have stood up and said, "Ah-hah! But you sometimes CAN divine motives!" Covering all bases, so to speak.

Once again, it is not about sensing any and all motives a target may have, but only under the specific circumstances allotted. Hence my inferring it shouldn't be used in anything remotely resembling the previous scenarios discussed.

[Cornuto]

The point of my statement was not to conjure up the idea that someone rolling Sense Motive can somehow read someone else's mind.

Lol, epic uses of sense motive:

Sense Motive

The character can discern a target’s alignment and even detect surface thoughts.

Task ......................................DC
Discern partial alignment............ 60
Discern full alignment .................80
Detect surface thoughts .........100

Discern Partial Alignment

This use of the skill lets a character discern one component of a target’s alignment. When making the check, the character states whether he or she is trying to discern the law-chaos or good-evil component. A character can’t retry the check, and he or she can’t use this to discern more than one component of the alignment (but see below). The target must be visible and within 30 feet of the character.

Discern Full Alignment

This use of the skill lets a character determine both components of a target’s alignment. The character can’t retry the check. The target must be visible and within 30 feet of the character.

Detect Surface Thoughts

This lets a character read the surface thoughts of a single target (as the 3rd-round effect of the detect thoughts spell). There is no saving throw to resist this effect, though the target can use Bluff to disguise his or her surface thoughts (see the Bluff skill description), in which case this becomes an opposed check (any result lower than 100 automatically fails). The target must be visible and within 30 feet of the character.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm

[The Almight Red]

Yes, fine! Epic uses of the skill! :P