Detect Good/Evil Discussion

[Lothoir]

Right now I'm a little wary about using the Protection from Alignment spell to block the detection abilities as not every character has access to them. To this I'm suggesting that items (rings, helms, cloaks) be put into the game that block detections.

Also, I'd like to request Mind Blank also be added to the list of spells that block detection.

[Scourn]

Well, its not really much of a problem, though i can see helms doing it. Perhaps have the helms cast it once per day? As for no one being able to protect themselfs, you can put one point into use magic device and buy the scroll, and ta da your protected. Of course id personally think you should have some kind of reason for the points you have in your skills, not get them to just do stuff like that, but any kind of evil PC who has half a brain would eventually learn how to use something that can hide what they are if they cant cast the spell themselfs.

[undeadsteak]

And i'd love to see detect good/evil prevention scrolls... Oh gods, just be careful where you use them, or everyones going to go "PPSST, HES EVIL! he used Prevention from Detect Evil!" >_<.

[Kaybrie]

I say the best way to prevent detect evil/good is to make it less favorable to use the skill to begin with, ie; a -1 or -2 cumulative penalty to wisdom each time you use the feat/spell that can only be removed through some form of restoration. Making Detect evil/good a far more serious thing to use, as roleplay-wise there are all too many people who'd just go around using it willy-nilly.

[Eternal Serf]

I really don't think its a good idea to begin changing spell effects on the caster; that is making them drain wisdom or the like from the caster. Why not make all harmful spells take constitution from the caster then? Its a slippery slope.

As to detect evil and masking alignment; I'm not sure its going to make a hill of beans either way. There aren't that many good types kicking around Sundren who aren't smart enough on their own to figure out who is out to get them or not.

As to detecting good; well thats a waste of time and energy; as any Paladin or Lawful priest will proclaim their alliance, making casting the spell at them a waste of time.

I'd like to see NPC's casting know alignment when folks enter temples and holy places. That should happen to weed out wrongdoers from taking advantage of the temples servants. As to players casting it, I believe it will be a waste of time or an annoyance more than anything else.

Alignment isn't a thing; its a state of mind and frankly it changes constantly for real people, in game terms they've given it a score, a number value, with I think any decent roleplayer could ignore or fake their way out of if questioned.

[undeadsteak]

NPC's casting know alignment whenever somone goes into a temple? Okay. As soon as you put in an evil temple for evil chars, im fine with that. But otherwise, thats pretty much the only place to buy shit.

[Lothoir]

While it is certainly feasible to put a point in UMD and stock up on scrolls I don't see much of a reason against putting in magic items to block detection, we have magic items that do a lot more, and if one was afraid of a sudden detection spell he could simply stick his hands in his pocket and slip the ring on, or keep it on 24/7, which is much more subtle than warding yourself whenever a champion of good and right strolls by.

I'd also like to repeat my request for blocking of detection to be extended to the Mind Blank spell, as that is more or less one of its primary functions in Pen and Paper.

[Scourn]

As to detecting good; well thats a waste of time and energy; as any Paladin or Lawful priest will proclaim their alliance, making casting the spell at them a waste of time..

Paladin, sure. Lawful priest? Theres lawful neutral and lawful evil... As for blackguards useing it, theres chaotic good and neutral good. If the good people are sent there to infiltrate a evil group, blackguards checking the people makes perfect sence.

As for the whole "alingment isnt a thing" thats a debate thats gone on since the begining of DnD, so pointless to discuss it.

[GodBeastX]

I'm not putting in 24/7 block items.

Part of the detection ALSO is to know if your smite evil or smite good will work on someone.

Personally, I came from servers where detect evil and detect good had NO penalty. Most of the time paladins didn't use it much. Ironically, blackguards used it all the bloody time, just to find allies they could trust and stuff.

Like said earlier, it doesn't take a genius to guess most of your alignments. Some of you aren't as good at hiding it as you thinking you are

"Ma'am he's dying!"

"And this is my problem because..."

HMMMM! WONDER WHAT ALIGNMENT SHE IS!?

I do agree with eternal serf though that people are too bound to their alignments. It's your choices making you evil, not the evil making your choices. So if you don't want to be evil, Don't be. You'll shift and problem solved.

Overall my seeing of fear in evil's eyes is a good thing. I personally, am being overwhelmed with tons of rule the world evils. They admit to it, act like it doesn't matter if they're outward or inward, and basically put DMs in tough positions where we have to decide what happens to them. The more players who know what's up with that one character, the easier our choice becomes.

Anyway, the feats work, they are using a custom rule because the three rounds of detection was impossible to get the way I wanted. You CAN be overwhelmed by an aura, which will wind up stunning you for a long time. Aura strengths and such follow the books. Prot from Good protects against Detect Evil, and Prot from Evil against good. These two spells have no lasting visuals so you can safely have them on and be indistinguishable from others.

[Kendaric]

"Ma'am he's dying!"

"And this is my problem because..."

HMMMM! WONDER WHAT ALIGNMENT SHE IS!?

Well, could actually also be chaotic neutral or true neutral in addition to the evil alignments, it all depends on circumstances.

Back to topic however...

I don't think we need a penalty for detect evil/good, the simple chance of being overwhelmed by the aura should suffice to prevent abuse. Like GbX, I've played on servers with that ability before and it was very rarely used at all.

[Scourn]

There needs to be the penility because its not a "simple chance" of being overwhelmed. The "evil power" has to be 11+ AND double your character level. Highest chance of this happening is if your trying to detect a cleric of a evil deity. The cleric has to be atleast lvl 11 and the person detecting can be no higher then level 6. If they are, the cleric needs to keep being double their level. If your 11 and detecting a level 20(pre expantion) you cant be overwhelmed. So its not really a simple chance.

[GodBeastX]

Meh, the more people argue over this the more I want to say "Just use it as much as you want." I think, given that there's too many showy evils, this might make them shut their yaps and try to be inconspicuous more. I've stunned many paladins of good in my days of playing evil (Love blackguard) but survived them all. Just play smarter and know any chance someone could detect you Make some scrolls of prot from good if you're worried that much.

[Vuzantar]

Are evil characters that rampant within Sundren? I have one of both but my evil one doesn't get out much into the public eye. I've been following this "evil" thing and am wondering if playing a good character would be within the minority.

Hrm... maybe a poll is needed?

and sorry for being a little off topic.

[GodBeastX]

No poll is needed. You just gotta read between the lines. If not many people were playing evil, you think anyone would have a problem with detect evil? That answers the question for you.

[Raksha]

Remember, a Wand of Protection from Alignment costs Not All That Much and is good for about a hundred in-game hours of consecutive use. ^_^ Talk to your local wand makers! Stimulate the player economy!