Official Paladin Code of Conduct

[[DM] Grinning Death]

I think you misunderstood, we have the same view. That being, as long as the paladin follows the general rules, he can RP how he wants.

Also, I think you may be confining the lore of Ilmater to very small boxes. By using terms as 'impossible' and 'never', you miss the fact that a paladin could heal all who are hurt, but punish those who are wicked. Or, alternatively, he could refrain from healing all who are hurt and focus on punishing the wicked to stop them from hurting others. There are a thousand ways to interpret the lore, and trying to nail it down to a specific one is cutting loose RP options.

Nothing needs to be one way or another. A paladin can RP how they want, as long as they stick to the code and a reasonable interpretation of their gods dogma.

[cmosier]

So... Two people of the same faith have a major difference in how they believe their God's Dogma should be followed?

That's a bit of a stretch.

[Laurk]

Well let me put it this way. In the opinion of the staff, would a Paladin of Ilmater be forbidden from standing idley by while thief guild members walk into a temple of Ilmater to be treated by healers so long as they don't try to hurt anyone while there? Im not talking about wanted murderers or sadistic zealots of evil gods. Is it within "reasonable dogma" for a Paladin of Ilmater to reserve violence only for when people in said temple come under attack? Would they be able to accept a donation to the poor from an evil but self-interested Thayan wizard so long as no strings are attached? Or would these be viewed as a violation of paladin code which forbids them from associating or working with evil?

I certainly don't confine Ilmatari RP to any box, of course there are all manner of Ilmatari. Everything from self-flaggulating sadists, to those who torture others because its "holy" to suffer, to violent crusaders who hunt down evil and finally to pacifists. There are a near infinite number of Ilmateri possible, I just want to make sure that no one feels precluded from having a paladin who can associate with a pacifist healer's temple because of Paladin code, and these are "grey" areas that id love to see some clarification on. This has nothing to do with any individual paladin or their personal viewpoint. Im just more curious where the line is drawn for paladin code.

Infact, just to display one bit of the amazing plethora of viewpoints and variety among Ilmateri, here is one of hte best source links ive ever seen to the Ilmateri clergy and its many many outlooks, infightings and disagreements. Anyone looking for ideas for playing an Ilmateri that seems non-conventional will find this a very interesting read:

http://archive.is/wY1WX

Here's another: https://lde001.obsidianportal.com/characters/ilmater

[[DM] Grinning Death]

Well let me put it this way. In the opinion of the staff, would a Paladin of Ilmater be forbidden from standing idley by while thief guild members walk into a temple of Ilmater to be treated by healers so long as they don't try to hurt anyone while there?

They wouldn't be forbidden, no. There's no violence being offered or innocents in danger, so there wouldn't be violence in return as via the paladin code.

Im not talking about wanted murderers or sadistic zealots of evil gods. Is it within "reasonable dogma" for a Paladin of Ilmater to reserve violence only for when people in said temple come under attack?

They can use violence when they believe innocents are in danger, or when violence is being offered to them, as per the paladin code.

Would they be able to accept a donation to the poor from an evil but self-interested Thayan wizard so long as no strings are attached?

While not technically working with evil, the paladin would likely be cautious, because evil. But it could be seen as a sign of redemption, which is what paladins might be willing to accept, depending on how they interpret their dogma.

Im just more curious where the line is drawn for paladin code.

Before it starts, and after it ends.

You're really reading too much into this. People choose how they want to interpret their god's dogma, as long as it's within paladin code. Please, let it drop.

And for reference, I'll leave this right here:

Ten Points of Paladinhood

1. Respect the law and lawful authorities.
2. Help those you can.
3. Protect those who need protection.
4. Do no evil, and associate with no evil.
5. Tolerate no blasphemy against your god or those gods deemed allies of your god.
6. Partake in no excess that will inhibit your ability to execute your god's will.
7. Be relentless in your pursuit of the next worthy quest.
8. Be unerring in your word.
9. Respect your enemy, for in respect is understanding, and in understanding is redemption.
10. Let wrath be merciful in its decisiveness.

[Phantom Lamb]

I think it would be useful to put Lotus' Ten Points in the Sundren Wiki. You'd see less players getting into trouble with breaking the code.

[Laurk]

Sounds good! Thanks for the info.

[OnyxTigress]

I think it would be useful to put Lotus' Ten Points in the Sundren Wiki. You'd see less players getting docked when, in their minds, they are behaving according a code. It's just not THE code. Wiki would make it more visible and set clearer expectations.

I can do this.

It is done.

Paladin

[Elusa]

So here's the problem in my opinion. Paladins tend to be cookie cutter stormtroopers (obviously with exceptions). Moreover, people seem to think that's exactly how they're supposed to be. Characters seem aghast that one paladin's oaths might be different from theirs.

[[DM] Grinning Death]

That, in my opinion, stems from a lack of actual knowledge on what the code entails and therefore an overly strict adherence to the few aspects that are known (Stamp evil, be good). Once players take the time to actually look up the basic code of being a paladin, they then have to layer on their god's dogma to it in order to play a paladin of that specific god correctly. If you have a shaky foundation with zealous adherence because of a lack of understanding, you're not going to get a stable paladin character.

However, provided the player looks up the proper information on how to play one, then adds the flavor of the god sponsoring the paladin on top, you get one that follows the code as a background to promoting his god's dogma as interpreted.

Also, it may be because there are only three paladin gods in the paladin/cleric faction with all the gear designed for the class, and therefore more paladins that act a similar way.

[Elusa]

That, in my opinion, stems from a lack of actual knowledge on what the code entails and therefore an overly strict adherence to the few aspects that are known (Stamp evil, be good).
...
Also, it may be because there are only three paladin gods in the paladin/cleric faction with all the gear designed for the class, and therefore more paladins that act a similar way.

I think you're exactly right. Also, players who play paladins are deathly afraid of breaking the code and losing all their shiny paladin powers. It was a real problem in the past. DM's were very strict on paladins sticking to their oaths word for word. So we ended up with like 2-3 paladins tops.

[Fuzziebunny]

Where are these cookie cutter pallies? I RP with roughly half the pallies on the server. They are all different and have their own gods dogma down for the most part. Am I just missing them?

Edit: I know of 6 pallies off hand but that is just triad maybe more in other factions.

[[DM] Grinning Death]

She was simply commenting on the similarity of various paladins, which is understandable when most paladins fall within three gods.

[Fuzziebunny]

I guess I just don't see it, but then I spend a lot of time RPing with the various pallies so I have a differen perspective. Maybe at just a glance ithey do look a lot alike. .

[Elusa]

She was simply commenting on the similarity of various paladins, which is understandable when most paladins fall within three gods.

And it's also just a personal viewpoint. Outside looking in and all that. Thing is, I don't see "Paladin of Tyr," "Paladin of Torm," "Paladin of Ilmater." They're just... paladins. Sometimes it's even hard to tell who's a paladin and who's a cleric.

That being said, there are plenty of unique, nuanced, and enjoyable paladins. I don't mean to generalize across the board.

[Jhickey]

We all must be weary that the lore in FR and a paladin are far different from the basic D&D rules. I know I have mentioned it before, but each of the gods have a differing view of what is expected out of paladins. Helm is one that is LN, he values protection of the weak above all. So if a paladin of Helm was sent to aid an evil society from say a more evil threat, let's say troops of Bane, he must protect the society at all cost. And even have to work with evil members of his own order.

I will put some excerpts from Greenwood when I get the time. But each code is really open to personal interpretation of the individual; which makes for great RP by the way.