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  • Spell Suggestions

    There are a few spells in NWN2 that are so absurdly powerful they completely overshadow other spells of their level and widen the already massive gap between mundane classes and spellcasting classes and should be removed. There are also spells that were changed in the conversion from PnP to NWN2 that they are incredibly underpowered. And finally, there are spells that exist in PnP that are not in NWN2, but would make good and useful additions to the server.

    To start with:

    Remove
    Issac's Greater Missile Storm/Issac's Lesser Missile Storm: Not much needs to be said on the topic of these spells. They are instant kills for any PvP matchup, and are even worse when Arcane Scholars empower the greater version. They have a gargantuan area of effect and the longest range possible, while capable of doing 120 points of irresistible damage to anyone lacking spell resistance (everyone except clerics). There is no reason these spells should exist.

    Lesser/Greater/Superior Resistance & Conviction: A large part of the reason that IGMS and Maximized Sonic Orbs are such popular spells are because spells that rely on failed saves to do damage are terrible. Clerics and Wizards, but mostly clerics, can boost their saving throws to ridiculous levels by layering Superior Resistance and Conviction for a massive +11 to all saves, which is further bolstered by the +4 against spells from 20 ranks in spellcraft, and the +3 from Nightshield, for a total of +17 against all saves before taking into account any of the other spells or items that increase one's saving throws. These spells do not exist in PnP and for good reason.

    Avasculate Instantly cut your opponent's health in half and stun them unless they succeed on a Fort save, in which case they lose half of their hit points anyways.

    Greater Stoneskin/Premonition DR 20 and DR 30 is silly. Wizards can already Mirror Image and Displace themselves, as well as teleport, summon walls, instant kill a fighter, and more. All these spells do is make a wizard more invulnerable against a fighter than they already are.

    Modified

    Bigby's Forceful Hand: Against a creature with 38 strength, the spell will fail half of the time. As it stands now, this spell absolutely destroys anyone not warded by a Freedom of Movement spell. It should be changed to be more in line with it's PnP counterpart. Specifically, a Hand creature should spawn that can be attacked. It should have 20 AC and hit points equal to the caster's total. Disintegrate and successful Dispel Magic attempts should destroy it. At the beginning of every round it should make a bull rush attempt to knock the target down for one round.

    Bigby's Grasping Hand As above, but with a bonus of +16 instead of +14 to the Bull Rush.

    Bigby's Clenched Fist Create a targetable Fist as above, but rolls for damage normally.

    Bigby's Crushing Hand Change the spell to offer two subradial options: Crush and Bull Rush. In both cases a targetable hand is created that can be attacked. If the Crush option is selected it will function as it does now. Bull Rush will cause it to make a bull rush attempt every round with a +18 bonus.

    Undeath's Eternal Foe Please remove the 250 gp casting cost and make this minute per level. It is otherwise an absolutely terrible spell, and even with these changes it won't be much better.

    Acid Fog, Acid Splash, Scintillating Sphere, Stinking Cloud, Web
    These are all conjuration spells that bypass Spell Resistance in PnP. They should be changed to bypass SR in NWN2.

    Storm of Vengeance Compare with the PnP version. At the very least, this spell should affect everyone in the area, the caster, their allies, and neutrals included. It should also require the caster to concentrate to maintain the spell, much as the Detect Evil and Detect Undead spells do. Further, a spellhook should be added so that any spellcasters attempting to cast in the area of the Storm much make a Concentrate check to do so, or lose the spell. Characters should also make a Fortitude save to avoid being deafened, rather than a Reflex save to avoid stun and electrical damage. The damage should also be scaled to mirror the gradual progression in the PnP version of the spell, rather than flat 9d6 damage + stun every round for characters that fail the Reflex save.

    Tenser's Transformation As a wizard, James has a lot of spell slot items, as well as Intelligence and Wisdom items for even more spell slots. The Polymorph effect causes him to lose these spell slots whenever he casts the spell. Furthermore, as a high level character in the Hands he has access to some nice weapons. Rather than polymorph the character, I would ask that the normal bonuses be applied, but that the caster gains the Martial Weapon proficiency feat for the duration of the spell, forcing the wizard to carry a sword or axe or what have you around with them.

    Greater Dispel Magic In NWN2 the caster cap for Greater Dispel is +15. In PnP it is +20. It should be changed to +20.

    Mordenkainen's Disjunction Rather than give the caster an uncapped dispel check, it should dispel all active buffs/effects without a check. This is a 9th level spell capable of destroying artifacts of the gods after all, and would make casters seriously think before walking around as buffzillas when they could lose them all at a moment. I also know of more than a few fighters that would love to watch the field of 4-5 lvl 20 clerics and wizards suddenly lose all of their buffs with one spell from their own wizardly buddy.

    Shadow Simulacrum
    Illusionists really don't have anything going for them in NWN2; fixing the bug that limits you to a target with 1/2 the caster's HD to the stated value of a target with twice the caster's hit dice would be a very welcome change.

    Undeath to Death This spell was changed on Sundren to make vampires immune to it. Considering that they are already immune to Death Effects, Mind Affecting Effects, Paralysis, Petrification, Ability Damage, Ability Drain, Critical Hits, Sneak Attacks, Energy Drain, Poison, Disease, Sleep, and negative energy I see no reason they shouldn't be vulnerable to a 6th level Will save.

    Alarm Please, please, please remove the VFX and annoying buzzing sound. Also, when the caster currently leaves an alarmed area the alarm spell disappears. It would be far more useful if it stayed for the full duration, regardless of what area the caster is in. That way a character could Alarm a door or corridor, then move well far away and do their secret dealings. If the alarm is tripped they'll have ample time to run away or prepare for the intruder.

    Nondetection Apply a local integer to the target with the caster's level + 11 (Caster level + 15 when cast on elf). Have detection spells check this int and roll the diviner's caster level against the DC.
    James Arrow: Potion Vendor

  • #2
    Add
    Wall of Force/Ice Illusionary Wall is one of my favorite spells, but is relatively ineffective against characters with a Will save. Wall of Force would only last a round per caster level, but be indestructible unless subject to a successful Dispel Magic or a Disintegrate spell. Wall of Ice would be similar to a Wall of Force, but have hp and a vulnerability to fire damage.

    Screen This would primarily be for DM rp events, but for day to day usage the second function of the spell would be useful. Upon casting the spell, all Locate Creature attempts targeted at creatures in the designated area would fail.

    Dimensional Anchor With a successful ranged touch attack the target is blocked from all forms of extradimensional travel. This would include teleport effects (Shards/Banite Holy Symbols), Dimension Door, and Etherealness.

    Dimensional Lock A 20 ft radius AOE that functions as the Dimensional Anchor described above, but affecting all travel into or out of the target area.

    Teleport without Error Teleport the character and any in-range allies to the Aquor nexus, unless the caster is a member of a faction. In that case teleport them to their faction HQ.

    Teleportation Circle Create a portal VFX that lasts the specified duration (10 min/level) and teleports anyone that enters the zone to the same area a Teleport Without Error would transport them to.

    Baleful Polymorph
    Transmute an enemy into a harmless chicken or pig! Allow a Remove Curse spell to undo the polymorph.

    Secret Chest Summon a persistent chest that lasts until the caster moves 10 ft away from it.

    Seeming Disguise Self is already in the game. Seeming is just a Mass version, giving all of your allies within the area of effect their own Disguise UI.

    Detect Scrying Alert the caster with a text message whenever someone casts Locate Creature on you. If you beat them in an opposed level check you also get the name of the caster as well as their current location.

    Detect Evil/Good/Law/Chaos This is a staple cleric spell, and Nondetection is already implemented as both a spell and a consumable potion/wand. One thing I would point out, Detect Alignment spells are aligned. Evil clerics and clerics of evil gods can not cast Detect Evil and Good clerics and clerics of good gods can not cast Detect Good. Same thing for Law and Chaos.

    Undetectable Alignment Nondetection has been implemented for wizards and rangers, but not for clerics, bards, or paladins. This is a lower level spell that accomplishes the same thing and lasts 24 hours. Unlike Nondetection, Undetectable Alignment can not be seen through, regardless of the diviner's level.

    Hallow/Unhallow 40 ft radius AOE that applies a +4 bonus to all Turn Undead/Rebuke Undead checks in the area. The two spells cancel each other out.

    Comprehend Language Tie into the DMFI system to allow anyone with this spell active on them to understand the spoken words of any character. they can not speak the language, however.

    Word of Recall Function as a Teleport Without Error, but with the location of your deity's temple. If there is no temple to your deity in game, default to your faction HQ or to Aquor's Nexus.

    Forbiddance 60 ft diameter/level AOE that blocks all dimensional travel. Additionally it damages all creatures entering the area that do not share your alignment, even allies and neutrals.
    James Arrow: Potion Vendor

    Comment


    • #3
      All of these suggestions sound really cool. Unfortunately, we lack manpower to make them (or so I think.) I'll wait for GBX to comment, but that's as far as I know.
      "Use the Force, Harry" -Gandalf

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      • #4
        Lothoir can do them.
        Originally posted by Cornuto
        Glad everyone's being extra fucking ridiculous today.

        Comment


        • #5
          I'd say remove Etherealness as well.
          Olivia Kimaris - Paladin of Lathander and Knight of the Northern Watch
          Diary of Olivia

          Originally posted by Cornuto
          Glad everyone's being extra fucking ridiculous today.

          Comment


          • #6
            If anything, I'd make etherealness so that any other spellcasting triggers its dispelling.
            "Use the Force, Harry" -Gandalf

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            • #7
              If anything, I'd make etherealness so that any other spellcasting triggers its dispelling.
              Reply With Quote
              Was completely my idea.
              Lauan - knight of Thay " I have no fear, and death is merely an inconvenience to me. I do not die until ordered to do so, I do not fall until every last bit of life has left me. I stand tall, proud, a Thayan knight."

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              • #8
                Tensers Transformation is a pain in the arse. Not sure there's another way to disable all magic items and spell casting. Not without potential issues anyway.
                It is the greatest of all mistakes to do nothing because you can only do a little - Do what you can.
                Sydney Smith.

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                • #9
                  I see no reason to remove spells when creating magic completion items with charges or uses per day, feat replication items, and proper magic weapons will make 'mundane' classes more effective sustained characters. I'm not sure if any of you have paid any attention at all, but a rogue or a weapon master with normal, spell-enhanced weapons does more damage in one round than Eirimil does with a Maximized Disintegrate (which is the single strongest spell in the game). They can already do as much damage as my wizard can in one round, what is a wizard good for once his spell run out? Why are we considering a rest system that will (if implimented) make my wizard a complete waste of space half-way through a dungeon run while a Weaponmaster, Rogue, Frenzied Berserker, etc. is capable of doing what my best spells do every round, without rest, 3-5 times?

                  Superior Resistance and Conviction are from the pen and paper book Spell Compendium. They do exist in pen and paper, and presumably stack there as well. Avasculate halves current HP - it can never kill a target on it's own, and is specifically used to counter targets with masses and masses of hit points. It's one of the only reasons to not drop Necromancy as a prohibited school. Isaac's spells are mitigated heavily by anything being there to distribute the damage (or, in NWN2, any sort of magic resistance. Eirimil himself almost completely ignores Greater Missile Storms because of his 5/- Magic Resist). Mordenkaiden's Disjunction already has a built-in Spell Breach that triggers before it's dispel effect which removes all of the spells that a Breach affects automatically.

                  I agree with some of the modifications: making the Bigsby spells targettable effects as they should be, fixing Shadow Simulacrum, uncapping Undeath to Death, conjurations bypassing SR, and Greater Dispel Magic getting it's proper dispel check. Greater Stoneskin is perfectly fine the way it is: it's Stoneskin that has been increased two spell levels, given a 50% damage cap increase, is self-target only, and still is bypassed by adamantine. Premonition is supposed to be a bonus to a single check, but I honestly have no problem with it the way it is aside from the spell cost, because wizards already fall over dead at the slightest provocation anyway and giving them a little breathing room against all of the nasty dual-weilding spear/warmace 30+ strength nonsense that Sundren has isn't a bad thing and players can get adamantine weapons. It's not a big deal, don't make it out to be.

                  And if we're suggesting fixing Bigsby spells, I want Mordenkaiden's Sword to be accurately made impervious to all physical damage (IE: 100% immunity to slashing, bludgeoning, piercing), with only vulnerability to dispelling and disintegration. I'd also suggest fixing the Summon Creature spells, but with that small change I'd only ever really use Mordenkain's Sword so it wouldn't really concern me as much.

                  On a side note: adding more spells only compounds issues because as soon as you get a certain number of spells in your spellbook, every time you transition the entire PW crashes. Every single time. I know, because Eirimil is at that point, and it's one of the reasons I haven't been logging in much lately. I applaud the effort, but it's not going to work out how you think it will.

                  Edit: tl;dr - Why are we suggesting changes that would make Arcane Casters more impotent than they already are when it's only Gish and self-buff clerics that are defying Sundren's arbitrary 'low-magic' and lololololing all the way to the bank?
                  Last edited by Satoshi; 10-27-2011, 12:32 PM. Reason: Opinion on Avasculate added.
                  Active
                  Reinamar Stormseeker - The bladestorm that must turn back the wind. Arkerym of The People, practitioner of the forgotten art, pariah.

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                  Eirimil Gaelazair (Dead)- Bitter. Caustic. Abrasive. Egocentric. Probably right. Found dead in the burned-out Viridale forest a few weeks after the survivors were able to sweep the area after the Bloodmaim offensive. Aside from his usual attire, an intricate music box was the only thing in his possession.

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                  • #10
                    Why are we suggesting changes that would make Arcane Casters more impotent than they already are when it's only Gish and self-buff clerics that are defying Sundren's arbitrary 'low-magic' and lololololing all the way to the bank?
                    Are we playing the same server? Wizards are crazy.
                    Originally posted by Cornuto
                    Glad everyone's being extra fucking ridiculous today.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      No, a fully buffed wizard with all of their spells prepared are crazy against whatever their chosen target for the day/rest is. That is working as intended - that's what wizards do. Depending on the spells they have prepared, they can drag out their usefulness a bit longer or a bit shorter. My best option as a wizard is to polymorph myself into something better, because it doesn't waste as many spells. Unfortunately, that wastes my extra spell slots per day items, thus perpetuating the cycle. A sorceror who prestiges into Arcane Scholar is breaking the system, because metamagic doesn't work in NWN2 like it does in pen and paper
                      Active
                      Reinamar Stormseeker - The bladestorm that must turn back the wind. Arkerym of The People, practitioner of the forgotten art, pariah.

                      Tyler Penleigh - Obligatory author insert, Red Blade Defender, sarcastic jerk, caring brother, loving fiancé, war criminal.

                      Retired/Dead
                      Eirimil Gaelazair (Dead)- Bitter. Caustic. Abrasive. Egocentric. Probably right. Found dead in the burned-out Viridale forest a few weeks after the survivors were able to sweep the area after the Bloodmaim offensive. Aside from his usual attire, an intricate music box was the only thing in his possession.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think the changes would be good.
                        Although, I do think Magic Missile should have a toggle, either one target, or an area, closer to the P&P version where you can shoot one missile each at 5 opponents.
                        And Stoneskin should have it's cap increased to 150 anyway.

                        The alteration or addition of more RP-type spells would certainly be welcome, like Alarm, Detect Alignment, Undetectable Alignment, Comprehend Languages, Tongues, and such, would be useful to those of us who don't power-build characters into pillars of physical or magical might.

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                        • #13
                          A sorceror who prestiges into Arcane Scholar is breaking the system, because metamagic doesn't work in NWN2 like it does in pen and paper
                          Magic period doesn't work in NWN2 as it does in PnP. When the spells were written, the intention was never for every high level caster to throw up every single buff they have on themselves and become dreadnaughts.

                          Regarding fighters blowing things up with damage, that's really only when you add spells like GMW and G. Heroism to the equation. Otherwise, they don't have the AB to offset either the Improved Power Attack or Expertise they're using to get those big damage numbers / stay alive. So the wizard/cleric enables that damage dealing.

                          No, a fully buffed wizard with all of their spells prepared are crazy against whatever their chosen target for the day/rest is.
                          How often is a wizard going into a dangerous situation without all of their buffs and spells prepared?
                          Originally posted by Cornuto
                          Glad everyone's being extra fucking ridiculous today.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by roguethree View Post
                            Lothoir can do them.
                            Agreed! Let's get him scripting.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by roguethree View Post
                              How often is a wizard going into a dangerous situation without all of their buffs and spells prepared?
                              Everytime they go into a situation because no wizard has enough spell slots to prepare ALL their buffs and spells.

                              on a more serious note
                              when they step on a dispell trap when they are already in a situation

                              when they step on a dispell trap in a non rest area that they cant get back out of without going through enemies

                              When the melee guy is going down and runs straight back toward them
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