Ethereal Update

[Zorkaplex]

According to PnP rules, an ethereal being can be seen using a spell of True Seeing or See Invisibility. Given that the caster can see an ethereal being, they are able to hit their ethereal target with a force effect originating on the Material Plane such as Magic Missile or Blast of Force and so on.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbi...m#etherealness

After doing some testing with the help of Catastrophe we discovered a few things that I would like to suggest.

For one, after casting both See Invisibility and True Seeing, we found that a player still could not hit an ethereal target with magic missile or any spell for that matter. If it at all possible, it would be awesome if this could be altered so that it matched up with the PnP rules.

It is also said that if both beings are on the Ethereal Plane, then they will interact normally. Unfortunately we found that this does not seem to work either, so I also would like to suggest this feature.

In addition, we were surprised to find that area of affect spells like Wall of Fire and Blade Barrier injured the ethereal being. This does not match up to the rules of etherealness as described in PnP. I am not sure if this is a bug or not, but it was something that caught my eye.

Lastly, the spell Zone of Revelation says that it should draw ethereal beings out of the Ethereal Plane. However, once tested, this did not hold to be true. No rolls were ever made against the ethereal target.

Due to the lack of my knowledge with the game mechanics, I am unsure as to exactly how difficult these features would be to implement, but I feel that the adjustments to the spell would help level the playing field against casters that would simply run to the Ethereal Plane rendering their enemies essentially helpless to stop them. I appreciate any addition information or insight into this matter.

[Saulus]

Etherealness has never worked right, I told Obsidian about it awhile ago. Basically the whole effect is hardcoded and to try to make all that other stuff work with it is just a ridiculous pain in the ass.

There's no easy way to implement the above, which is why I'm inclined to leave it as is, for what doesn't work the benefits are enough.

[Tome]

Etheral beings are also supposed to move really slow too, but that looks impossible to put in from what I've heard.

Damn you Obsidian.

Look on the bright side Zork, at least it does not let you pass through walls and stuff in the game like it does in PnP, so at least there is SOME give and take regarding the spell.

[Cornuto]

They're also supposed to be able to fly and walk through walls.... good luck with that.

[Thief Of Navarre]

They're also supposed to be able to fly and walk through walls.... good luck with that.

As long as there is purchase to in the Ethereal plane! the fact that two Ethereal beings cant interact with one another must be a fatal oversight by they who shall not be named. (Obsidian)

[Root]

I hate the spell, personally. It's a Clerical I-Win, since it generally gives a free period to turn yourself invincible and get the drop on any class that can't counter it (generally, a high-caster level Abjurer with Mords).

Same for Wizards, in fact.

Things like that need counters.

[Machiavelli]

I hate the spell, personally. It's a Clerical I-Win, since it generally gives a free period to turn yourself invincible.

I've never seen it used that way. I only use it for running away!

[Root]

I'm happy with it being a run-away spell. That's a good function for it.

But not to utterly remove the disadvantages of being caught unprepared as a caster.

[Zorkaplex]

Etherealness has never worked right, I told Obsidian about it awhile ago. Basically the whole effect is hardcoded and to try to make all that other stuff work with it is just a ridiculous pain in the ass.

There's no easy way to implement the above, which is why I'm inclined to leave it as is, for what doesn't work the benefits are enough.

I can completely understand that. I am certain that when role playing with others that we can do our best to adjust to this fact. Its not that big of an issue regardless, but I was a little curious if it had ever been looked at.

[Fezzik]

I don't see how a 7th and 9th level spell could be considered "I win" when a second level spell can counteract it . So what if you can't attack the person in the ethereal state, if they can be seen, that's a completely different kettle of worms.

Besides that for all the people that complain about meta-gaming, you have to actually tell people that your Ethereal when you're standing right in front of them all white and glowy... they should be invisible. * shrug *

[Root]

What second-level spell can counter it?

If you're talking See Invisibility, then, well, unless you have area of effect attacks (I.E Casters), you can't do anything.

A Clerics general point is that it can beat a fighter when buffed, but not if they aren't. This spell gives them all the time they want to buff, removing their weakness.

That spell alone beats any Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Fighter, Barbarian, Rogue and any of their respective PrC's.

It's why I'm so paranoid whenever I go into CvC with casters at high level. It's not my style to cut off RP by knockdowning and killing them, but I know that letting them get off a single Etherealness will mean my utter inevitable death unless I just turn and run like hell the moment they manage to become Ethereal.

Unless I'm missing something massively important about it.

[Machiavelli]

Do people really go ethereal to buff up? I've never seen it done. I'm sure it's technically within the rules, but it does seem kinda like a cheap trick.

[Root]

I've seen it done. Not here, but then I haven't had any high-level fights here.

Basically goes 'Right, that's it, Evildoer, I smite you!'

Evil Cleric: '*pops ethereal*'

Paladin: *stands blankly*

Evil Cleric: *starts buffing for about two minutes*

Paladin: *elevator music*

Evil Cleric: *when fully buffed and invincible, summons an undead, casts Storm of Vengeance, obliterates Paladin*

[Fezzik]

The only time I've used Etherealness is to infiltrate or spy (trying to figure out what's happening), I haven't needed it to run away... yet, and unless everyone is dead around me, I wouldn't, and I think using it to buff is cheap, just like HIPSing and bandaging up is (grabbing a banner will cancel stealth, but wrapping yourself up like a mummy apparently wont... ??? -end little rant)

And yes, see invisibility will cut through it apparently. Sorta like canceling a Bigby spell by casting shield or something goofy like that

[Thief Of Navarre]

If a monk/assassin comes and Death attacks you before you get to go Ethereal your pretty much dead in the water anyway.
Same can be said if an Enchanter drops Hold Monster on you, aint much you can do about it really..