More suggestions

[Subal]

Unless everyone plays a stormlord the weapon is useless

[Nil]

Unless everyone plays a stormlord the weapon is useless

But you can't make changes in a vaccuum.

[Subal]

Im not saying things should be changed, im mearly stating a fact, if you look at the weapons available, minus rp reasons. the Spear is completly useless for pretty much everyone cept the stormlord. This could be said for the Bert as well.

[Nil]

Im not saying things should be changed, im mearly stating a fact, if you look at the weapons available, minus rp reasons. the Spear is completly useless for pretty much everyone cept the stormlord. This could be said for the Bert as well.

The same can be said for any number of weapons, though. What good is a dagger to anyone but an IB (and it's tough to argue that an IB puts a dagger to better use than a Stormlord does a spear, especially in light of kukris)? Sickles? Greataxes (greatsword is better in every way), etc.

However, I will conceed that in real life, the halberd is one of the most effective melee weapons, whereas it's junk in D&D (even in PnP, they're junk compared to weapons like the Chain Whip). And that's just not right. But if we're talking about things D&D does wrong, this is a silly place to start.

[Infallius_Daemonium]

That was my point. The game is not prepared to handle the kind of combat that you would need in order to make this fair, so it probably shouldn't happen. Those who feel that spear is weak and underpowered and needs this boost, I direct you to the Stormlord.

I was just pointing out that your suggestion was really one sided for spear/halberd. A wider AOO range and the 'first hit' against shorter range weapons is hardly worth a penalty when fighting anyone in melee not using one.

Also, the Stormlord class doesn't help someone who decided to use a halberd for RP reasons.

[Doubtful]

Spears don't magically become useless at close quarters - They may be a pointy stick at one end, but they're also a stave.

It was also reasonably common to carry a dagger in the off hand.

Read.
http://www.rockymountainswordplaygui...outs/Lanza.pdf

Having two-handed spears with medium shields would also be a good option.

[Nil]

Spears don't magically become useless at close quarters - They may be a pointy stick at one end, but they're also a stave.

It was also reasonably common to carry a dagger in the off hand.

Having two-handed spears with medium shields would also be a good option.

Not sure what your point is. A penalty for someone being inside of your guard is not the same as "useless". It'd probably only be one round because you'd change your grip afterwards (holding the spear with a medium grip - as you'd do if you were using it as a stave doesn't provide much of a reach benefit over a sword - if any).

Making them 1-handed is a different discussion. Monkey grip already gives you the option of using a shield with your spear.

[Fezzik]

I've seen critters that are more than 5 feet away (Whirlwind attack reach) not be hit by said attack YET they are attacking me... and they're wielding big weapons.

[Doubtful]

One handed? I'm sure I said two handed with a shield..

Spears are extremely dynamic in combat, it's why they're a pretty devastating weapon, both up close and at range.

Course, as Chupacabra mentioned, DnD and real world considerations rarely mesh.

[Thief Of Navarre]

Im sure having AoO for moving through a ranged melee weapons square is workable if you can get the range mod working okay.

Temple of Elemental Evil had it *shrugs*

[GodBeastX]

I'm against the idea that there isn't a minimal amount of ability score to be something. Sounds like a means to powergame IMO.

[Quoth The Raven]

Meh, what do you get from 11 to 8? 3 points? And then you'd be left with an 8 which is no good. I don't think you get a noticeable advantage from the trade. In the end you always end up with 30 points (was it 30 or 32?) to buy stats with. It's not like you get an extra 3 all of sudden. Furthermore, if you can do it, everyone else can do it. Really I don't see the big deal.

Anyway, what's this stuff about spears and in guard and imba? I mean it's not PnP, you can't do a 5 ft step and then attack before the opponent moves again to be in contact with you. You try that in NWN2, you're just giving free attacks to the other dude.

The thing is, it just works this way: basically the reach is a number which is added to your natural reach (the white circle under your char's feet when he's unarmed). The result is the distance at which you can start to attack. Imagine a big circle around your char with radius equal to reach. Anything within it and in line of sight, you can attack, and get AoOs against. First cool thing you notice is that you get a lot less silly combats with the fighters all squeezed in 2 square meters. Second cool thing is that the area you menace (and the big thing here are AoOs) is dependant from the reach.

[Thief Of Navarre]

Min ability reqs make sense though (perhaps not 17 charisma for druid multiclass in 2E)!

Paladins for example cast divine spells and have charisma based abilities ~ you wouldnt think its strange if one turned up with 3 wisdom and 8 charisma! After all its not a question of 'what you get' from 8 to 11 or whatever, its what you dont get surely?

A commoner has ability scores of 10; most good or neutral adventurers should have stats that exceed that.

[Machiavelli]

I'm against the idea that there isn't a minimal amount of ability score to be something. Sounds like a means to powergame IMO.

*lives in dread of PCs with 8 wisdom and 1 level of cleric*

[The Almight Red]

Unfortunately, it's already possible. The only time it forces your ability scores is at level 1. You could easily start as level 1 something else, then take Cleric at second level and onwards with a 8 Wisdom.

Getting two free Domains in the process.

Power gaming, gooooooo.