More suggestions

[Quoth The Raven]

Weapons' Reach Tweaks
This is a major improvement to combat. Notice how the screenshots display combat that actually looks right. Also think how using a spear or a greatsword would give extra reach, making up for the loss of the shield. Can we get it?

More soundsets
There are soundsets from NWN1 that are quite good. I suggest all the NWN1 sounds are ported (2da entries are already present, we're merely missing the files), and that complete or almost complete soundsets from NWN1 and NWN2 are opened up to PCs (such as Gann's soundset, or Daelan Redtiger's).

Uncapped ability scores
Such as here. The idea is quite reasonable, really - I'll explain for the lazy ones who didn't click: you ever noticed how when you select a class, an ability automatically goes up to 11, and you can't go lower no matter why? Why do we need that? We all know that a wizard can't cast with 9 Int. But if I want to make a paladin with 10 Wis, why can't I do that?

[Thief Of Navarre]

Did you ever play 2e rules?

Ability requirements are there for a reason. iirc paladins and rangers were specialist fighters and required rediculous ability scores to play (which was good back then because mediocre characters would be brought up to scratch by minimum requirements). Likewise druids have similar crap to contend with!

As for the soundsets we already have the NWN2 NPC ones ones (thank you team). And most of the NWN1 soundsets were copy/pasted into NWN2 (Lazy Obsidian). Cant say its a bad idea though

As for weapon reach.... I heartily approve

[Quoth The Raven]

I did play 2nd ed... Ability requirements never made sense to me even then

For soundsets, problem is that they left the 2da stuff, and did not include the actual sound files (which were like 10 MBs total). So you can't hear the old stuff anymore, apart from some sounds which were ported (I guess they picked only the stuff they thought they were going to use).

[Fezzik]

Just be happy that paladins didn't keep their 1st edition requirements... or there wouldn't be as many... as ... there... hmm... maybe we should increase their char requirement to 17

[BedlamX]

Just be happy that paladins didn't keep their 1st edition requirements... or there wouldn't be as many... as ... there... hmm... maybe we should increase their char requirement to 17

Can you imagine trying to make an old-school bard after all these years of the current Bard?


The minimums don't bother me as much as most of the other restrictions on characters and PRCs, though. While I don't always play stereotypical characters, I do usually put at least the minimums into the abilities it calls for.

[Machiavelli]

Just be happy that paladins didn't keep their 1st edition requirements... or there wouldn't be as many... as ... there... hmm... maybe we should increase their char requirement to 17

Go ahead, try it. You know you can roll it on 3d6!

[chupacabra]

Weapon reach mechanics would be fantasic and add a lot! Admittedly, I haven't loaded up that modification, so I can't say I've tried out their implementation. The screen shots look promising.

Two-handed swords and axes recieve a significant damage boost already. However, a pole arm is merely a weapon that does similar damage to a one handed weapon, but uses two. This was balanced for and made more true to life in D@D, as the reach of a weapon was taken into the equation. NWN has not implemented this. The mod apparently has. Sounds cool.

In the old days of pen and paper, I made my fair share of halberdiers and spearmen, partly because they represented certain role in combat that was not represented by sword-and-board types. After all, the tactics of medieval warfare relied heavily on pikemen/spearmen. Even if there are no horses in Sundren, it does not mean there is no proper use for a spear!

Not to over complicate it too much, but I wonder if it is included (or possible) for a dagger-wielding creature to step inside the range of a long weapon's range, as is true in real life? Doubt it, but that would be amazing! In fighting and out fighting are the two credos of many a matial arts style.



More soundsets to play with is always fun, but as mentioned above several have already been added by the amazing dev team (you guys ROCK)! I used to run NWN2 with the NWN1 soundsets before, though, and I don't remember it being a big deal. Then again, I wasn't having to reckon how much extra downloading it would take for a server full of people. . .



Ability score caps. Hmm. I think Bedlam X is right: regardless of whether you want to play to a class 'cannon,' personally, I try to at least meet the requirements in spirit. If you want to sidestep such caps, it is easily done via thoughtful multiclassing anyway.

[Quoth The Raven]

Of course it's possible to move within the range of a spear, while you're using a dagger: you actually need to do that, in order to get the spearman within the dagger's reach and stab him in the eye.

Just one thing about class canon: what's the canon of a rogue or a fighter? Those are classes that contain so many different types of characters, that there's no canon. 11 strength, but my fighter is an archer who was assigned to the legion archers cause he couldn't even move under the weight of a shield! 11 dex, but my rogue is a half orc street thug with a big club, who just shrugs blows off while he proceeds to bash your head! See the problems?

[chupacabra]

Of course it's possible to move within the range of a spear, while you're using a dagger: you actually need to do that, in order to get the spearman within the dagger's reach and stab him in the eye.

I like it!
Does the spearman suffer from someone infighting him?
In real world terms, if an assailant steps inside the range of a pike, the pike man is left defenseless until he can get back into position to use the tip of the pike again.

Just one thing about class canon: what's the canon of a rogue or a fighter? Those are classes that contain so many different types of characters, that there's no canon. 11 strength, but my fighter is an archer who was assigned to the legion archers cause he couldn't even move under the weight of a shield! 11 dex, but my rogue is a half orc street thug with a big club, who just shrugs blows off while he proceeds to bash your head! See the problems?

I totally agree that 'canon' becomes easily confused with those classes, but they are also probably the most versatile and malleable: the rogue is basically a skilled person, the fighter basically a trained one, in my view. Prestige classes often serve as a more specialized and much more 'canonical' path for such classes to help flesh them out.

Other classes, especially the likes of Paladin, have had ability requirements included in pen and paper rules because they are more specialized. You are not so restricted in NWN, aside from first level, but the essence of the requirements tend to be met regardless. That is, a palladin with a negative CHA is unlikely to be able to serve the specialized role of his class very well, regardless of what the 'rules' state or don't state.

[Nil]

I like it!
Does the spearman suffer from someone infighting him?
In real world terms, if an assailant steps inside the range of a pike, the pike man is left defenseless until he can get back into position to use the tip of the pike again.

Agreed. Without this, you're just buffing spears and nerfing everything else. I don't mind a chance to draw an AOO by getting inside the spear's range (If you're using a dagger, you're probably tumbling through it anyway), but if I don't then have an advantage over the spear user, then this just gets silly.

[Infallius_Daemonium]

If spears got a penalty as soon as someone was point blank with them that would be a disadvantage for the entire combat except for the first couple swings at best. I'm assuming here that you could forcibly get closer, like you can already, to give him the negative if you're using a weapon without the penalty.

Is a person with a long range weapon getting to attack you first really worth penalizing them for the rest of the fight?

Also, from a realistic perspective the spear/pikeman’s opponent can't just run up to him and make him take a negative. He'd be more concerned with not getting impaled or hacked. You could make that an AOO, but you know OOC that this won't kill you, so anyone would be willing to do it... unlike on the battlefields of medieval Europe, or some such thing.

From a purely aesthetic perspective, I'd like the change. But, I'm not sure about modifying combat rolls because of it.

Oh, and I play a Wizard so this doesn't really affect me... heh.

[Nil]

Is a person with a long range weapon getting to attack you first really worth penalizing them for the rest of the fight?

Uh, yeah. You don't fight with a bow at close range. That's a good way to die. Archers carried swords for a reason. When I'm standing next to you, ventilating your chest, you're not going to be trying to aim a bow at me.

Of course, this is the same system that made it super-difficult to mages to cast in armor, but trivial for them to cast while getting whaled on, so I can see your point as well.

edit: if you're classifying a spear as a "long range weapon", then disregard my post about bows. Even so, there's nothing that says a spearman can't step back. NWN2 isn't designed to handle the complexity of a system that deal with melee weapon range.

[Infallius_Daemonium]

They do if they get point blank shot =) Then it's apparently just as easy to shoot someone stabbing you with a dagger. Though, they're going to try and stop you.

The system isn't realistic, and making it realistic for spears and halberds in a negative way will just penalize the few people who actually decided to use that weapon for non-power gaming reasons. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but I was under the impression that there's no reason, stat wise, to use a spear or halberd over something else in NWN2.

Edit: Yes the spearmen could step back, get an AOO, and then the dagger wielder etc would follow him as the game makes him do that already.

Edit edit: And yes, I was talking about spears/halberds as long range weapons... not bows.

[Subal]

Actually i found using either of those for most classes is infact hindering them already, no point in damaging them further , less you plan to up the damage of the weapons to make it fair.

[Nil]

Edit: Yes the spearmen could step back, get an AOO, and then the dagger wielder etc would follow him as the game makes him do that already.

That was my point. The game is not prepared to handle the kind of combat that you would need in order to make this fair, so it probably shouldn't happen. Those who feel that spear is weak and underpowered and needs this boost, I direct you to the Stormlord.